Sex education and religion

[John Wright]

23 minutes ago, Harry Lamb said:

It is exactly what you wrote, and you have helpfully confirmed that in your view parents should be denied the choice to send their children to a faith school to be educated. The option to send children to religious instruction outside of regular education is irrelevant to this central point, despite your attempted obfuscation. To be clear: I am not arguing the merits or otherwise of faith schools, but I am asserting the right of parents to choose one if that is their wish, a right which you seek to deny.

No, I’ve said exactly the opposite. I’ve said they should be able to have religious education of their children in the faith or denomination of their choice, provided by the church institution of their choice. Or none, if they are so inclined. 

It’s really non contentious in many countries that education is secular. The CofE and the Catholic Church on Island have input across the whole curriculum at St Thomas’s and St Mary’s. 

[Harry Lamb]

5 minutes ago, John Wright said:

No, I’ve said exactly the opposite. I’ve said they should be able to have religious education of their children in the faith or denomination of their choice, provided by the church institution of their choice. Or none, if they are so inclined. 

It’s really non contentious in many countries that education is secular. The CofE and the Catholic Church on Island have input across the whole curriculum at St Thomas’s and St Mary’s. 

You did not 'say the opposite'. You are trying to suggest that giving parents the right to choose religious instruction as an extra curricular activity is equivalent to giving them freedom to choose a faith school as the educational establishment for their children which it patently is not. Your second point is not germane to this argument. No matter how you wriggle, the fact remains that you are seeking to deny, or at least seriously curtail choice for parents.

[thommo2010]

 

For anyone wondering here are all the different genders. 

 

https://www.medicinenet.com/what_are_the_72_other_genders/article.htm

[NoTail]

I remember at King Bill's founded by the Bishop Barrow Trust we did have a few Catholics (Cole brothers come to mind). They were in the lucky position of avoiding daily prayers etc.

[Passing Time]

8 hours ago, AcousticallyChallenged said:

Better ban the school pantos too. Those ugly sisters could be men in a frock. 

Guess you are too stupid to know the difference eh…

[La_Dolce_Vita]

3 hours ago, Shake me up Judy said:

Would you be uncomfortable with Islamic preachers having access to our schools, or would that come under diversity and inclusivity ?

Teaching about the existence of other beliefs and the people who hold them is fine.  Teaching about the beliefs to give them credence or convince is not fit for schools.  Diversity and inclusiveness have very different meanings. Diversity is addressed by teaching about other people and about the existence of other beliefs.  Inclusiveness doesn't really have a relevance here.  

When I was at primary school we had religious people come in who would talk about Jesus or Christianity as if it was something that should be considered as factual.  Seems crazy looking back.  Nobody should even be treating these things as beliefs to consider as possibly credible in schools. 

As for religious schools, if they are privately funded then I suppose that is not as bad as the idea of anything being state-funded.  I disagree with the idea of society funding any religious education regardless of the wishes of parents.  If someone wants their child to have religious education then that's should be out of their pocket. 

Edited March 1, 2023 by La_Dolce_Vita

[x-in-man]

28 minutes ago, thommo2010 said:

 

For anyone wondering here are all the different genders. 

 

https://www.medicinenet.com/what_are_the_72_other_genders/article.htm

I’m with Gene Hunt on this.

[AcousticallyChallenged]

25 minutes ago, Passing Time said:

Guess you are too stupid to know the difference eh…

What is the difference?

Both are dressing up for performance, and both can be done either in a family friendly or provocative manner.

[Declan]

45 minutes ago, 2112 said:

IOMG have put out a press release on Facebook, informing they have commissioned a report by external investigators into this fiasco, and it’s asking the public to refrain from commenting. It’s the answer to all IOMG problems to commission a report. How much will it cost taxpayers? Will it achieve much? Another fine mess. 

What's going on here? Don't they know what was going on in their classrooms? That they need an outsider to find out who's been in their classroom.

[La_Dolce_Vita]

2 hours ago, Shake me up Judy said:

... As we're still to some degree a Christian culture, I have no problem with that and consider it part of a broad education.

I'm not sure what it really means when people claim that we are a Christian culture or country, to whatever degree. I'd tend to say that we are not and that's almost wholly about knowing how many Christians there are and their influence.  I don't put much weight in history and symbols of Christianity 

[AcousticallyChallenged]

41 minutes ago, Harry Lamb said:

You did not 'say the opposite'. You are trying to suggest that giving parents the right to choose religious instruction as an extra curricular activity is equivalent to giving them freedom to choose a faith school as the educational establishment for their children which it patently is not. Your second point is not germane to this argument. No matter how you wriggle, the fact remains that you are seeking to deny, or at least seriously curtail choice for parents.

Faith schools are also said to have a link between their culture of secrecy, discipline and abuse.

See for example the 2015 report by the UK's National Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Children (NSPCC), which found that “children who attended faith schools were less likely to report abuse than those who attended non-faith schools. The report noted that this could be due to a range of factors, including a lack of knowledge about abuse, fear of retribution, and cultural or religious beliefs.“

[Shake me up Judy]

1 hour ago, AcousticallyChallenged said:

From their website:

We are developing a St Mary's curriculum written for our school and centred around our Catholic Faith.

For the last time: It's a State school, taxpayer funded, and follows the same national curriculum as the Island's other primary schools. Within that it may reflect a degree of Catholic values and ethos. But that's it.

[AcousticallyChallenged]

Just now, Shake me up Judy said:

For the last time: It's a State school, taxpayer funded, and follows the same national curriculum as the Island's other primary schools. Within that it may reflect a degree of Catholic values and ethos. But that's it.

Their website sure makes it sound like it stands out. See the post you just quoted. 

[Hoops]

8 hours ago, AcousticallyChallenged said:

Better ban the school pantos too. Those ugly sisters could be men in a frock. 

Panto dames, where males dress up as females and the audience laughs at how ridiculous they look. I'm surprised you are a fan!

[Gladys]

Having gone to a Catholic school in the 60s, I think schools should be secular.  Admittedly, I doubt some of the 'teachings' then would be tolerated now, but it was a hellfire and brimstone type of education.  There was also very little compassion (a Christian attribute?) and quite extreme treatment of some pupils. 

I had the misfortune of being the product of a mixed marriage (RC and protestant, would you believe?) so was a bit of a target, particularly from the nuns.  I was removed for the last two years of primary school to a private school after some dubious treatment.   

I genuinely believe that education I received in those two years did more to set me on the right course than the previous four at the hands of that malevolent Christian educational establishment.