Douglas Combined Sixth Form

[2112]

An article on the the NPM this morning about Chris Thomas and Ann Corlett complaining of overcrowding at the 2 Secondary Schools in Douglas especially for the sixth form, and his suggestion that they have their own campus for education. I agree, there is overcrowding as evident at Ballakermeen and it’s use of portakabins as classrooms. 
 

What does concern me is the possible use of brownfield sites in Douglas. The civil service have earmarked Park Road site for another school, when this site should be used for housing - sheltered and FTB town houses. If another school was built, then it will possibly cost £ms and as with the usual IOMG largesses, contractors, architects and engineers will be rubbing their hands at a nice little earner.

Why not use Fairfield School, which could at minimal cost be refurbished, and I’m sure would be big enough. They could extend using the car park after all IOMG is encouraging active travel, so teachers and pupils should either walk or cycle. The building is lying empty and will become an eyesore before, I’m sure Chris Thomas will push for its recommission (unless he is looking at pie in the sky needlessly spending taxpayers money?). 

[Andy Onchan]

44 minutes ago, 2112 said:

An article on the the NPM this morning about Chris Thomas and Ann Corlett complaining of overcrowding at the 2 Secondary Schools in Douglas especially for the sixth form, and his suggestion that they have their own campus for education. I agree, there is overcrowding as evident at Ballakermeen and it’s use of portakabins as classrooms. 
 

What does concern me is the possible use of brownfield sites in Douglas. The civil service have earmarked Park Road site for another school, when this site should be used for housing - sheltered and FTB town houses. If another school was built, then it will possibly cost £ms and as with the usual IOMG largesses, contractors, architects and engineers will be rubbing their hands at a nice little earner.

Why not use Fairfield School, which could at minimal cost be refurbished, and I’m sure would be big enough. They could extend using the car park after all IOMG is encouraging active travel, so teachers and pupils should either walk or cycle. The building is lying empty and will become an eyesore before, I’m sure Chris Thomas will push for its recommission (unless he is looking at pie in the sky needlessly spending taxpayers money?). 

I've never understood why 6th Form education in Douglas has to be split or even Island-wide. It's madness.

Why can't they use University College Isle of Man at either The Nunnery or Homefield Rd, if there's room?

[manxman1980]

7 minutes ago, Andy Onchan said:

I've never understood why 6th Form education in Douglas has to be split or even Island-wide. It's madness.

Why can't they use University College Isle of Man at either The Nunnery or Homefield Rd, if there's room?

Transport...

Would you want to try and bring all the sixth formers into Douglas and return them home each day?  Or even worse that they decide to drive themselves.

Having the sixth form attached to high schools spreads that load.

[Andy Onchan]

1 hour ago, manxman1980 said:

Transport...

Would you want to try and bring all the sixth formers into Douglas and return them home each day?  Or even worse that they decide to drive themselves.

Having the sixth form attached to high schools spreads that load.

Strange how other jurisdictions manage it.

So two students studying A level (whatever) and another three studying the same in another school uses two teachers (plus all the associated costs that goes with that) when one would do. Spreading the load costs more.

[Derek Flint]

It needs one island Centre. Public transport is good enough to maintain this

[Mr Helmut Fromage]

Bemahague was built to a design that could be extended if required and there is space - it would require additional access probably from the main road near the entrance to the Government House.

Extend this and make it for 6th form studies for Douglas & Onchan students - frees up space in Ballakermeen and less need for Mobile classrooms, use St Ninians for the formative years of secondary education up to GCSE.

I've never figured out why a shiny new school with modern facilities is used by 11 years olds and the 16-18 years olds get stuffed into a terrible antiquated Victorian mess on Bray Hill.

[ellanvannin2010]

9 minutes ago, Mr Helmut Fromage said:

Bemahague was built to a design that could be extended if required and there is space - it would require additional access probably from the main road near the entrance to the Government House.

Extend this and make it for 6th form studies for Douglas & Onchan students - frees up space in Ballakermeen and less need for Mobile classrooms, use St Ninians for the formative years of secondary education up to GCSE.

I've never figured out why a shiny new school with modern facilities is used by 11 years olds and the 16-18 years olds get stuffed into a terrible antiquated Victorian mess on Bray Hill.

Which bit of St Ninians is Victorian?

[manxman1980]

1 hour ago, Andy Onchan said:

So two students studying A level (whatever) and another three studying the same in another school uses two teachers (plus all the associated costs that goes with that) when one would do. Spreading the load costs more.

I do not know any of the high schools that run a programme with low take up levels.  In fact I remember that some sixth form students swapped schools so they could do the A levels they wanted.  That suggests that your scenario of a cohort of two at one school and a cohort of three at another simply is not happening and it is much more likely that students move schools to do the courses they want. 

58 minutes ago, Derek Flint said:

It needs one island Centre. Public transport is good enough to maintain this

I don't think public transport is good enough to manage bringing ever sixth form student on the island to one location.  Maybe from the main towns but what about students in the more rural areas which are not so well served?  Would you run special services for this new sixth form college or would you expect the students to use scheduled services?  Would sixth form students be expected to attend for a full day (timetables are not usually full unlike in years 7 to 11) or would they come and go as required? 

[Mr Helmut Fromage]

1 hour ago, ellanvannin2010 said:

Which bit of St Ninians is Victorian?

Architectural Period Fascist..............

[2112]

If something can be done by either using one of the educational establishments, without splurging taxpayers cash needlessly, then yes it has solved a problem. The island has many competing priorities at the moment, some are more urgent than others. 

[2112]

3 hours ago, Andy Onchan said:

Strange how other jurisdictions manage it.

So two students studying A level (whatever) and another three studying the same in another school uses two teachers (plus all the associated costs that goes with that) when one would do. Spreading the load costs more.

Politicos are very good at spending money, especially if it gets them re-elected. 

[Derek Flint]

17 hours ago, manxman1980 said:

I do not know any of the high schools that run a programme with low take up levels.  In fact I remember that some sixth form students swapped schools so they could do the A levels they wanted.  That suggests that your scenario of a cohort of two at one school and a cohort of three at another simply is not happening and it is much more likely that students move schools to do the courses they want. 

I don't think public transport is good enough to manage bringing ever sixth form student on the island to one location.  Maybe from the main towns but what about students in the more rural areas which are not so well served?  Would you run special services for this new sixth form college or would you expect the students to use scheduled services?  Would sixth form students be expected to attend for a full day (timetables are not usually full unlike in years 7 to 11) or would they come and go as required? 

From an educational standpoint, it makes absolute sense to have everyone in one place for sixth form. The Island tries to be all things to all people and forgets that it is smaller in population terms than many provincial towns. 

[manxman1980]

@Derek Flintsure it makes sense in one regard but the Island isn't a provincial town and the solutions that work best here aren't necessarily the best for a provincial town and vice versa.

I certainly would not support an all Island Sixth Form College being based in Douglas.  

[Derek Flint]

3 hours ago, manxman1980 said:

@Derek Flintsure it makes sense in one regard but the Island isn't a provincial town and the solutions that work best here aren't necessarily the best for a provincial town and vice versa.

I certainly would not support an all Island Sixth Form College being based in Douglas.  

This is the problem though. You can’t be all things to all people. Money is tight and cloth needs cutting accordingly 

[manxman1980]

2 hours ago, Derek Flint said:

This is the problem though. You can’t be all things to all people. Money is tight and cloth needs cutting accordingly 

I don't see how this reduces costs...  At the moment sixth formers going to a school can use the school buses already being used by those in years 7 to 11.  Move all the sixth form to a central location and you have to pay for additional services to get them to the new location.  Assuming it is in Douglas you also add to the traffic entering and leaving the town each day.

Then you have to consider how much overlap there is in A level subjects.  Teachers don't just teach A-level students.  I had the some of the same teachers in year 7 as I did teaching a level courses in years 12 and 13.  You will still need teachers for years 7 to 11 so where is the saving in teaching staff?

Even when it comes to resources you won't save much as you simply move them from the existing sixth forms to this new central location.  

In fact the more I think about it the more useless a centralised sixth form college sounds.