Bus Vannin in Crisis

[woolley]

3 hours ago, Mouthpiece said:

Yes more work taken off the private sector. 

It would have been Tours doing it at one time, as well as a lot of the school contracts. They even insisted on replacing minibuses that schools had funded themselves with BV.

[woolley]

12 hours ago, Mouthpiece said:

Nobody in the trade would agree that point. You call up and book a ride. But because it is government it magically isn’t a taxi service. Anyone else running that type of service would need a private hire license 😂 You can’t get a taxi up north now as there is no business to be had because of BV. Another private hire firm due to go too according to rumours specifically from being under cut by a taxpayer funded service. 

I can understand why the trade wouldn't agree, of course, but I've never been in a taxi that took me on an odyssey all around the North of the Island picking other characters up before taking me into town. Are ring and ride services across considered to be private hire taxis?

Same with that completely ridiculous BV service for the patients flight passengers that I think starts somewhere near Smeale at half past two in the morning, and goes down every road in the Island before rocking up at Ronaldsway hours later. Then they have to do the reverse process to get home. Some of the poor old buggers enduring this farce are 90 and ill. Almost 24 hours travelling for a 10 minute appointment in Liverpool rather than DHSC fund a taxi. Considering the government waste elsewhere, it's quite outrageous.

[woolley]

12 hours ago, Mouthpiece said:

See my first post. You can’t get a taxi up north as no taxi can make a living with Bus Vannin providing a £2 taxi service into Ramsey.

Or a free of charge service, presumably, if you have a "GO" pass.

[Cueey Lewis And The News]

The question seems to be when is a taxi service not a taxi service? The answer would appear to be only when it’s owned by IOM Government. They advertise that you can book a minibus in advance, it can pick you up at your house, and it can drop you where you want to go even if it isn’t at a bus stop. But it’s apparently not a taxi as it doesn’t have a meter and you can only pay a fixed fare regardless of where you're dropped off. So maybe it’s more like a South African bakkie service that brings people in from the Township to the city? Only it isn’t a knackered 25 year old Toyota Hi Lux pick up that people sit in the back of, it’s a brand new £90K Mercedes Sprinter bought by the taxpayer running at a massive loss as we’re the 8th wealthiest nation on earth. 

[The Voice of Reason]

Being on the outskirts of Ramsey and  having mobility issues  ( hopefully temporary) I used the “ Connect “ service to take me into town to deliver myself + 1 to a restaurant the other day.

It was easer to get in and out of the bus than any taxi.

For those not familiar how it works. You put in the addresses of where you want to go from  ( home in my case) and to where you want to go, and what time you would like to picked up. Online

We were given a time slot of fifteen minutes around the desired time but were kept up to date and could monitor online the progress of the bus. And were given a description of the bus ( Mercedes).

There was one other person on the bus, no idea where he had come from or going to.

It proved to be more reliable than any local taxi.

It cost £1.20 each, the same as a regular bus would.

We had to get a regular bus back because the service stops at 7 pm. But no problem.
Only downside was that having had no confirmation that my debit card had been charged with the £2.20 I paid the driver in cash, after which I received confirmation from my online banking app that the money had also been deducted from my account.

So I am £2.20 down which I could probably get back if I choose to pursue it. Which I won’t .

So yes it’s not doing the local taxi trade any favours. But they don’t deserve any given the hassle and aggravation involved in trying to book a ride. 

 

 

Edited September 29, 2023 by The Voice of Reason

[Banker]

7 hours ago, woolley said:

I can understand why the trade wouldn't agree, of course, but I've never been in a taxi that took me on an odyssey all around the North of the Island picking other characters up before taking me into town. Are ring and ride services across considered to be private hire taxis?

Same with that completely ridiculous BV service for the patients flight passengers that I think starts somewhere near Smeale at half past two in the morning, and goes down every road in the Island before rocking up at Ronaldsway hours later. Then they have to do the reverse process to get home. Some of the poor old buggers enduring this farce are 90 and ill. Almost 24 hours travelling for a 10 minute appointment in Liverpool rather than DHSC fund a taxi. Considering the government waste elsewhere, it's quite outrageous.

Why should the taxpayers fund taxis for patients transfers to airport or hospital when they are providing free transportation, this is the point it’s not a taxi service despite what some like to make out.

Many of these older passengers either have family members who can take them or can certainly pay for a taxi if they want 

[Non-Believer]

These minibuses may well be convenient (or not, depending on your POV); but the fact is that they are contributing to BV losses of millions a year that we are all paying for by other means of taxation.

[Fred the shred]

So Banker you think patients of limited means ,young and old, should fork out £50 plus from Douglas and much more from the North, to go for an appointment in Liverpool because the local hospital is unable to deal with their illness ?    Some people have not got this kind of money or relatives who can take them and collect them from the Airport.    It is not exactly a fun day out.    You must be a very miserable sort of person who  would begrudge a sick person transport in a bus which is usually pretty full, sick people pay or have paid taxes too.    Disgusting attitude with no pity or concern for people who are having a hard time with their health.

[Banker]

3 minutes ago, Fred the shred said:

So Banker you think patients of limited means ,young and old, should fork out £50 plus from Douglas and much more from the North, to go for an appointment in Liverpool because the local hospital is unable to deal with their illness ?    Some people have not got this kind of money or relatives who can take them and collect them from the Airport.    It is not exactly a fun day out.    You must be a very miserable sort of person who  would begrudge a sick person transport in a bus which is usually pretty full, sick people pay or have paid taxes too.    Disgusting attitude with no pity or concern for people who are having a hard time with their health.

I never said that I was referring to private taxis which someone’s said should be provided rather than patients having to go a a free transfer from anyone on Island.

The patient transfers bus is a great service.

[Fred the shred]

Apologies Banker I misread your post.

[woolley]

10 hours ago, Banker said:

Why should the taxpayers fund taxis for patients transfers to airport or hospital when they are providing free transportation, this is the point it’s not a taxi service despite what some like to make out.

Many of these older passengers either have family members who can take them or can certainly pay for a taxi if they want 

 

4 hours ago, Fred the shred said:

So Banker you think patients of limited means ,young and old, should fork out £50 plus from Douglas and much more from the North, to go for an appointment in Liverpool because the local hospital is unable to deal with their illness ?    Some people have not got this kind of money or relatives who can take them and collect them from the Airport.    It is not exactly a fun day out.    You must be a very miserable sort of person who  would begrudge a sick person transport in a bus which is usually pretty full, sick people pay or have paid taxes too.    Disgusting attitude with no pity or concern for people who are having a hard time with their health.

 

4 hours ago, Banker said:

I never said that I was referring to private taxis which someone’s said should be provided rather than patients having to go a a free transfer from anyone on Island.

The patient transfers bus is a great service.

 

2 hours ago, Fred the shred said:

Apologies Banker I misread your post.

I don't think it is a great service at all. It replaced taxis and it is not fit for purpose. As Fts said originally, many of these people are of very limited means. Some of them are extremely ill, or very old, or both, and not everybody has relatives or friends that can drop other commitments to provide transport to the airport early on weekday mornings. It is unreasonable to expect poorly people to rise in the middle of the night before embarking on a grand tour of the Island in what might be a painful, stressful, or even terminal situation, before having to endure a repeat performance in reverse in the evening.

I would love to see the full economics of this BV activity compared to the former practice of providing taxis. I appreciate that an argument could be made that some can well afford to fund their own taxi, and no doubt some do considering the ridiculous alternative. Even if the provision of practical transport was restricted to those on the lowest incomes it would be something.

What happened to the caring society we were supposed to be building?

 

 

[Lilly]

4 hours ago, woolley said:

 

 

 

I don't think it is a great service at all. It replaced taxis and it is not fit for purpose. As Fts said originally, many of these people are of very limited means. Some of them are extremely ill, or very old, or both, and not everybody has relatives or friends that can drop other commitments to provide transport to the airport early on weekday mornings. It is unreasonable to expect poorly people to rise in the middle of the night before embarking on a grand tour of the Island in what might be a painful, stressful, or even terminal situation, before having to endure a repeat performance in reverse in the evening.

I would love to see the full economics of this BV activity compared to the former practice of providing taxis. I appreciate that an argument could be made that some can well afford to fund their own taxi, and no doubt some do considering the ridiculous alternative. Even if the provision of practical transport was restricted to those on the lowest incomes it would be something.

What happened to the caring society we were supposed to be building?

 

 

Didn't patient transfers used to offer escorts to take you to the airport and then accompany you to your hospital appointment?  I'm not quite sure what has happened to this very valued group of volunteers? 

 

[Banker]

8 hours ago, Lilly said:

Didn't patient transfers used to offer escorts to take you to the airport and then accompany you to your hospital appointment?  I'm not quite sure what has happened to this very valued group of volunteers? 

 

Don’t remember that but they do fund escorts if considered necessary by consultants eg elderly people, cancer treatment, where mobility before or after surgery is poor.

[John Wright]

44 minutes ago, Banker said:

Don’t remember that but they do fund escorts if considered necessary by consultants eg elderly people, cancer treatment, where mobility before or after surgery is poor.

Nowadays the surgeon or consultant doesn’t have the say. It was thought they were a soft touch. Didn’t want to upset their long term Dr/Patient relationship by refusing.

It’s internally assessed by the PT office. Of course the consultant can recommend, but doesn’t get blamed if the answer is no.

Frankly, most of the patients, even the very ill ones, are more seasoned travellers, and better organised, than the business travellers who spend ages blocking the aisle as they remove coats, fold, remove jackets, fold, try and fit bags in overhead bins, get them out again.

They're often the ones who have their seat belts off and are standing in the aisle whilst the plane is still taxiing, with phone clamped to their ear.

There are some passengers who shouldn’t be allowed to travel.

[John Wright]

9 hours ago, Lilly said:

Didn't patient transfers used to offer escorts to take you to the airport and then accompany you to your hospital appointment?  I'm not quite sure what has happened to this very valued group of volunteers? 

 

Not in my living memory. I think that was when transfer was by sea to Liverpool, there were very few transfers in those days and you had to be very very ill..

More recently off duty nurses on medical evacuations on the air ambulance.*

Now a family member or friend, is allowed, occasionally, in extremis..

* my recollection is that this stopped after the plane downed in the Mersey with total loss of life, crew, patient, escort, and DHSC refused to pay enhanced death benefit for death whilst working because the accompanying nurse was a volunteer.