code99 Posted October 13, 2022 Share Posted October 13, 2022 Only swivel-eyed right-wing loonies would argue that the UK/ the IoM are absolutely free of racism and prejudice of any kind. That said, an abduction followed by a rape at a gunpoint (fake or real) is extremely grievous criminal offence and race should not come into it. The victims (the unnamed young woman, and her family by association) were subjected to an unspeakable terror. Most rape survivors need a huge amount of support and assistance to rebuild their confidence and their shattered trust in humanity. Even when the physical harm has healed, the phycological trauma could last for years, possibly for the rest of their lives. It would be utterly contemptable if the perpetrator of this heinous crime was white and therefore got off lightly. The ‘excuse’ that the advocate gave for his client’s violent and aggressive behaviour was that that evening he “had drunk alcohol and consumed cocaine and cannabis”. Once again, the Island’s drugs problem (i.e., seeming ease of access to drugs) has been put under the spotlight. The advocate said he was also “intelligent” and from a “good home” …and yet this supposedly person of ‘good character’ had been trying for nearly 2 years to deny his responsibility and to wriggle out of it. Without full details and an intimate knowledge of the case it is impossible to conclude whether this 24-year-old man is a congenital monster or had just ‘lost it’ in a moment of madness due to being high and intoxicated. This is a very important case to bear in mind, before changing rules around the consumption of recreational or even medical cannabis, IMHO. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeliX Posted October 13, 2022 Share Posted October 13, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, code99 said: This is a very important case to bear in mind, before changing rules around the consumption of recreational or even medical cannabis, IMHO No it isn't. Cannabis had nothing to do with this case other than allowing the defence to try to clutch at straws. The story makes a better case for banning alcohol than it does for not legalising cannabis. Edited October 13, 2022 by HeliX 3 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shake me up Judy Posted October 13, 2022 Share Posted October 13, 2022 I wasn't in court, but have you considered that the mother was probably distraught. Who wouldn't be ? Hence the race card. Perhaps with hindsight Stu wouldn't have posted the comment but in no way was it racist to do so. That's just some of you Manx inbreds having another pop at him because he's from a different gene pool. Leave the guy alone. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slinkydevil Posted October 13, 2022 Share Posted October 13, 2022 7 minutes ago, Shake me up Judy said: Perhaps with hindsight Stu wouldn't have posted the comment but in no way was it racist to do so. That's just some of you Manx inbreds having another pop at him because he's from a different gene pool. Leave the guy alone. Racism = wrong. Calling Manx inbreds = right. smh 3 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chef Raekwon Posted October 13, 2022 Share Posted October 13, 2022 22 hours ago, Roger Mexico said: The trouble as ever is in describing people as 'racist'. It's something that is almost impossible to prove and will never convince most of those so described, because they have even more faith in their own virtue even more than the most indulgent mother. What we need to look at is what people say and what they do, because words and actions can be more easily identified as racist. Perhaps Stu should think about why his reaction to reading that long and upsetting report was to highlight a particular part at the end and make a snidey remark about it. Quite clearly an opportunistic comment from Stu on the basis that he thinks it proves that he's right that people who claim that black people suffer fromracism are wrong. "See, I told you that black people are wrong when they claim they suffer from racism" Quite sad really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Peters Posted October 13, 2022 Share Posted October 13, 2022 2 hours ago, Chef Raekwon said: Quite clearly an opportunistic comment from Stu on the basis that he thinks it proves that he's right that people who claim that black people suffer fromracism are wrong. "See, I told you that black people are wrong when they claim they suffer from racism" Quite sad really. Please don't put words into my mouth. I know that racism still exists, as do a huge number of other '-isms'. Maybe its coded into our DNA to be fundamentally tribal and something we should acknowledge whilst wrestling with it philosophically. The point about this story is that when a conviction for a horrendous proven crime is challenged by default (even under stress) as a racist miscarriage undermines genuine societal problems that most of us should want to fix. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeliX Posted October 13, 2022 Share Posted October 13, 2022 3 minutes ago, Stu Peters said: The point about this story is that when a conviction for a horrendous proven crime is challenged by default (even under stress) as a racist miscarriage undermines genuine societal problems that most of us should want to fix. I wholly disagree. What one mother may have said during extreme stress has no ability to undermine actual societal problems. Media and forums amplifying what she said doesn't help though. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manxfisherman Posted October 13, 2022 Share Posted October 13, 2022 23 minutes ago, Stu Peters said: Please don't put words into my mouth. I know that racism still exists, as do a huge number of other '-isms'. Maybe its coded into our DNA to be fundamentally tribal and something we should acknowledge whilst wrestling with it philosophically. The point about this story is that when a conviction for a horrendous proven crime is challenged by default (even under stress) as a racist miscarriage undermines genuine societal problems that most of us should want to fix. Why paraphrase what she said and add your own bit though? Why would you do that? There has to be a reason that someone would take a quote, change it a little and tag a made up bit on to it. What is that reason? If you'd just quoted the words she'd actually said that would have been fine, but you editorialised it and made something up. That is not good, not good at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Peters Posted October 13, 2022 Share Posted October 13, 2022 1 minute ago, manxfisherman said: Why paraphrase what she said and add your own bit though? Why would you do that? There has to be a reason that someone would take a quote, change it a little and tag a made up bit on to it. What is that reason? If you'd just quoted the words she'd actually said that would have been fine, but you editorialised it and made something up. That is not good, not good at all. I'd seen the story the day before and simply paraphrased, no evil intent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manxfisherman Posted October 13, 2022 Share Posted October 13, 2022 2 minutes ago, Stu Peters said: I'd seen the story the day before and simply paraphrased, no evil intent. But you made a bit up! Like, you are now the chairman of the Post Office. In their annual plan you talk about the current trading difficulties and you comment on the challenge posed by the gig economy. If I editorialised it to say "Stu Peters says Evri are a disgrace" it would be wrong, regardless of the fact they actually are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiVibes Posted October 13, 2022 Share Posted October 13, 2022 (edited) 35 minutes ago, Stu Peters said: Please don't put words into my mouth. Like you do to others you mean? Edited October 13, 2022 by HiVibes 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manxweegie Posted October 13, 2022 Share Posted October 13, 2022 Are you all mad or missing the point? The mother has literally said "“My son is there because he’s black. You are all against my son because he is black.” Stu has literally paraphrased the remark as "He's a lovely boy and was only convicted because he's black (according to his mother)." Christ Stu even referenced his source!!!! Can someone explain to me how these are so different that 3/4's of you are looking to start something over nothing?? The mother who has raised this scumbag of a monster let us not forget is saying the only reason her son is being prosecuted is due to ethnicity? 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apple Posted October 13, 2022 Share Posted October 13, 2022 5 hours ago, Shake me up Judy said: Perhaps with hindsight Stu wouldn't have posted the comment but in no way was it racist to do so. That's just some of you Manx inbreds having another pop at him because he's from a different gene pool. Actually I am from the same 'gene pool' and it was my initial response to his comments. I am not a "Manx inbred" which in itself could be regarded as inappropriate. I have always been intrigued by the phrase "there's a boat in the morning" since we moved here in 1989 and to be hones tI can now understand some of the frustrations of those people born here. 43 minutes ago, Stu Peters said: Maybe its coded into our DNA to be fundamentally tribal and something we should acknowledge whilst wrestling with it philosophically. I quite agree. The point I was making was that you are in fact, like it or not, someone whose views can be unconsciously emulated by some without the insights you have. I know the view expressed on here are your own, as are mine, but some people just can't read the small print. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Peters Posted October 13, 2022 Share Posted October 13, 2022 13 minutes ago, manxfisherman said: But you made a bit up! Like, you are now the chairman of the Post Office. In their annual plan you talk about the current trading difficulties and you comment on the challenge posed by the gig economy. If I editorialised it to say "Stu Peters says Evri are a disgrace" it would be wrong, regardless of the fact they actually are. I take your point, but think you're stretching it. The mother (clearly aghast at the conviction) chose to ignore the evidence and deliberations and accuse the court of racism rather than acknowledge the actions of her son. The defence made great reliance on how he was a successful student and reliable person from a good family. Yet he's been convicted and sentenced to over 12 years. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apple Posted October 13, 2022 Share Posted October 13, 2022 Two things about the issues with this case which I apprehensively suggest may help. Watch on Netflix the film Luckiest Girl Alive. (Changed my views about rape and misogyny !! ) More importantly read the book The Devil You Know to understand the basis upon which which people's upbringing can and does govern future behaviour. No more to say really on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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