Is climate change a fraud?

[Anyone]

4 minutes ago, The Voice of Reason said:

MMT ?

Google it.

[The Voice of Reason]

Just now, Anyone said:

No that would be suicidal for the IOM financially. The IOM has no option but to stay with sterling/

Well duh!

[The Voice of Reason]

1 minute ago, Anyone said:

Google it.

Just did. Top result is “ Make my trip” Most helpful, thank you

[Anyone]

Just now, The Voice of Reason said:

Just did. Top result is “ Make my trip” Most helpful, thank you

Modern monetary theory. But I’m not as no tail suggests an advocate of it. But it’s worth researching as most things and perhaps adopting the best bits.

[The Voice of Reason]

Just now, Anyone said:

Modern monetary theory. But I’m not as no tail suggests an advocate of it. But it’s worth researching as most things and perhaps adopting the best bits.

Could you not have just told me that instead of your snidey “  Google it” which lead to me to a completely different result?

Is it too much trouble to clarify what you mean?

[Anyone]

3 minutes ago, The Voice of Reason said:

Could you not have just told me that instead of your snidey “  Google it” which lead to me to a completely different result?

Is it too much trouble to clarify what you mean?

Bit tetchy tonight?

and it wasn’t me that mentioned MMT.

[Fred the shred]

I believe climate change is real but setting dates and spending money that is desperately needed for more urgent uses is totally unjustified.   Recycling, yes absolutely, cutting down on plastic especially single use plastic bottles yes absolutely, but having a team of people on pensionable salaries doing exactly what ? No.   Onshore wind turbines that will end up costing more than the Liverpool Terminal is not feasible  and for the small contribution that two of them will make is not the best idea.    If the Government really want to splash out some money lend homeowners money to install solar panels at a low interest rate over say 10 years. Setting dates is never a great idea either who could have forecast Covid and the fallout that is still being felt.

[Jarndyce]

13 hours ago, Fred the shred said:

I believe climate change is real

I believe for every drop of rain that falls, a flower grows…

[Moghrey Mie]

15 hours ago, Fred the shred said:

I believe climate change is real but setting dates and spending money that is desperately needed for more urgent uses is totally unjustified.   Recycling, yes absolutely, cutting down on plastic especially single use plastic bottles yes absolutely, but having a team of people on pensionable salaries doing exactly what ? No.   Onshore wind turbines that will end up costing more than the Liverpool Terminal is not feasible  and for the small contribution that two of them will make is not the best idea.    If the Government really want to splash out some money lend homeowners money to install solar panels at a low interest rate over say 10 years. Setting dates is never a great idea either who could have forecast Covid and the fallout that is still being felt.

Solar panels are not suitable for many houses because of their orientation.

[Happier diner]

56 minutes ago, Moghrey Mie said:

Solar panels are not suitable for many houses because of their orientation.

That's a bit queer. 

[Cambon]

1 hour ago, Moghrey Mie said:

Solar panels are not suitable for many houses because of their orientation.

I don’t think his suggestion would be mandatory. 

[The Bastard]

20 hours ago, Fred the shred said:

I believe climate change is real but setting dates and spending money that is desperately needed for more urgent uses is totally unjustified.   Recycling, yes absolutely, cutting down on plastic especially single use plastic bottles yes absolutely, but having a team of people on pensionable salaries doing exactly what ? No.   Onshore wind turbines that will end up costing more than the Liverpool Terminal is not feasible  and for the small contribution that two of them will make is not the best idea.    If the Government really want to splash out some money lend homeowners money to install solar panels at a low interest rate over say 10 years. Setting dates is never a great idea either who could have forecast Covid and the fallout that is still being felt.

Climate change doesn't require an element of belief, like a religion. It's an observable fact. Global temperatures are rising, ice sheets are disappearing. glaciers are in retreat, sea levels are rising, sea acidity is rising, plant and animal species are changing, extreme weather events are becoming more frequent.

Much of that is measurable and doesn't require any element of belief to make it real. That rate of change is measurable, since temperature, sea levels and ice cores record evidence, and it ties in with a rapid change in the modern industrial era.  Just this week, the news stories I read featured ski resorts in the alps closing due to a lack of snow. The unfortunate people affected can't choose to believe their way out of that. 

The use of solar panels and wind turbines is not only related to climate change. It also focuses on energy independence, which will be more important as the IOM economy inevitably declines - finance will go, gaming will go, industry has gone, tourism has gone. We have a rare window of opportunity of having a budget to drop some of the the reliance on oil and gas in the future. Looking ahead, there will be no big budgets for large-scale infrastructure to replace it, since there will be no tax revenues to support it. Like low alpine ski resorts, this place is finished and we can't just believe our way out of that. Best to set everything up while we still can. 

Political instability in the Middle East, Russia and America is going to affect oil and gas prices for decades, and not in a good way for the shrinking number of future IOM residents. For anyone, particularly in public office, its should be obvious that a full dependence on oil and gas for an isolated rock is a huge mistake when sustainable local resources are available.

Sustainable electricity is a marketable, attractive resource that could be a huge strategic bargaining chip for anyone looking ahead for economic opportunities. AI for example requires huge amounts of energy. Anyone who would consider themselves fit to be an IOM politician should be looking to exploit it, not in focused denial because they like driving big cars for the 20 miles that constitutes an epic journey on the IOM. Energy independence should be one of the most pressing issues the IOM needs to address, even if climate change wasn't on the radar at all.

[NoTail]

9 hours ago, The Bastard said:

Climate change doesn't require an element of belief, like a religion. It's an observable fact. Global temperatures are rising, ice sheets are disappearing. glaciers are in retreat, sea levels are rising, sea acidity is rising, plant and animal species are changing, extreme weather events are becoming more frequent.

Much of that is measurable and doesn't require any element of belief to make it real. That rate of change is measurable, since temperature, sea levels and ice cores record evidence, and it ties in with a rapid change in the modern industrial era.  Just this week, the news stories I read featured ski resorts in the alps closing due to a lack of snow. The unfortunate people affected can't choose to believe their way out of that. 

The use of solar panels and wind turbines is not only related to climate change. It also focuses on energy independence, which will be more important as the IOM economy inevitably declines - finance will go, gaming will go, industry has gone, tourism has gone. We have a rare window of opportunity of having a budget to drop some of the the reliance on oil and gas in the future. Looking ahead, there will be no big budgets for large-scale infrastructure to replace it, since there will be no tax revenues to support it. Like low alpine ski resorts, this place is finished and we can't just believe our way out of that. Best to set everything up while we still can. 

Political instability in the Middle East, Russia and America is going to affect oil and gas prices for decades, and not in a good way for the shrinking number of future IOM residents. For anyone, particularly in public office, its should be obvious that a full dependence on oil and gas for an isolated rock is a huge mistake when sustainable local resources are available.

Sustainable electricity is a marketable, attractive resource that could be a huge strategic bargaining chip for anyone looking ahead for economic opportunities. AI for example requires huge amounts of energy. Anyone who would consider themselves fit to be an IOM politician should be looking to exploit it, not in focused denial because they like driving big cars for the 20 miles that constitutes an epic journey on the IOM. Energy independence should be one of the most pressing issues the IOM needs to address, even if climate change wasn't on the radar at all.

Your argument is sound but you offer no pathway/solution. I would suggest going for the low hanging fruit first. use to £Xm budget to put solar panels on as many buildings and car parks as possible. Solar panels are cheap and established technology. Once done, and that would be at least 5 to 10 years we can look at the existing other systems. 

[Happier diner]

2 hours ago, NoTail said:

Your argument is sound but you offer no pathway/solution. I would suggest going for the low hanging fruit first. use to £Xm budget to put solar panels on as many buildings and car parks as possible. Solar panels are cheap and established technology. Once done, and that would be at least 5 to 10 years we can look at the existing other systems. 

Solar panels are not cheap. Not sure where you get your information. They are also not as established as wind turbines. 

40MW by installing roof solar panels. Wow that worth cost zillion times than inshore wind. 

[Moghrey Mie]

https://ups-solar.co.uk/residential-solar-panels/

Some prices of solar panels.