TT 2023

[Ghost Ship]

2 hours ago, John Wright said:

Ireland does have equivalent legislation to the UK and IoM about exclusion of liability by way of unfair contract terms and in particular those that limit liability for injury and death. They’re all based, in their current version, on EU directives.

But, and  here’s the rub, they’re aimed at consumers. A spectator around the course is a consumer in this context, even if they haven’t paid. In any event they’ve not signed up to any exclusion, unless they’re in a paid for area...

Well that's interesting.

I didn't appreciate that the protection against "signing away your rights" in the event of death or personal injury caused by somebody else's negligence was limited only to people acting in the capacity of consumers.

So does that mean that if I decide to take up a formally organised but high risk sport as a competitor, and die or get seriously injured as a result of the organisers' negligence, that any exclusion clause I may have signed would be effective in excluding the organisers' liability?  Or does it mean that I would have to be acting as a consumer to make it ineffective?

2 hours ago, John Wright said:

... Theres an interesting issue then as to the status of a competitor who signs a disclaimer or avoidance. They aren’t a consumer. Or is the law starting to consider them as consumers...

Whether you are talking about road racing or some other sporting event I think it's certainly arguable that competitors are consumers unless their main trade or business is getting paid to participate as a professional contestant in that particular sport.  More so if they are paying an entrance fee.

But until reading your post it had never crossed my mind that whether you were or were not acting as a consumer would have any relevance at all to the question of whether or not you could limit somebody else's liability for your death or PI caused by their negligence.  [Edit:  TBH I still find it a bit difficult to believe that it does make a difference... ]

Edited February 14, 2023 by Ghost Ship

[Ghost Ship]

On 2/11/2023 at 3:01 PM, John Wright said:

But that isn’t anything to do with the event insurance. It’s wholly separate. It gives basic cover, at admittedly very low levels, where the death or injury is not caused by the negligent fault or action or neglect, or nuisance, of the organisers...

Yes - I know.  Sorry.  I only mentioned it because you'd referred to it in response to a post from Happier Diner where I think you were trying to put right some misunderstanding on his part.  I wasn't intending to  conflate if with event insurance 

[John Wright]

8 hours ago, wrighty said:

@John Wright

What’s your view, as an experienced observer of all things Manx, a lawyer, and general wise counsel, as to the long term prospects of TT carrying on?

I’m not an expert in the field. So called experts should never opine outside their field of expertise.

[WTF]

1 hour ago, John Wright said:

I’m not an expert in the field. So called experts should never opine outside their field of expertise.

tongue in cheek, piss take intended, it doesn't usually stop you .    

[Happier diner]

7 minutes ago, WTF said:

tongue in cheek, piss take intended, it doesn't usually stop you .    

I never thought there was anything outside of his field of expertise

I am so disappointed. At least its some progress that he has realised after all these years

[0bserver]

Seems the TT brigade have a bit of a knot in their panties over this insurance business. 

[GD4ELI]

1 hour ago, 0bserver said:

Seems the TT brigade have a bit of a knot in their panties over this insurance business. 

Linky?

[wrighty]

5 hours ago, John Wright said:

I’m not an expert in the field. So called experts should never opine outside their field of expertise.

Cop out, and you know it. 

[Roger Mexico]

34 minutes ago, wrighty said:

Cop out, and you know it. 

Nah, it just means he's not going to give away for free something he might be paid for.

[John Wright]

53 minutes ago, wrighty said:

Cop out, and you know it. 

 

17 minutes ago, Roger Mexico said:

Nah, it just means he's not going to give away for free something he might be paid for.

Cop out, yes. I’m not going to put my neck on the line to be a target for the TT diehards or the TT haters.

Ive tried very hard to upset neither side, over the years. Not my battle.

[Happier diner]

1 hour ago, wrighty said:

Cop out, and you know it. 

[forestboy]

5 minutes ago, Happier diner said:

Nothing wrong with his position 

[Happier diner]

2 minutes ago, forestboy said:

Nothing wrong with his position 

Absolutely not no. Although the guy in the picture doesn't look very comfortable

[John Wright]

54 minutes ago, Happier diner said:

 

47 minutes ago, forestboy said:

Nothing wrong with his position 

 

44 minutes ago, Happier diner said:

Absolutely not no. Although the guy in the picture doesn't look very comfortable

I’ve absolutely no interest in the TT. I’m not in a position to make meaningful comment. I don’t have anything to add to that debate or this.

[wrighty]

1 hour ago, John Wright said:

 

Cop out, yes. I’m not going to put my neck on the line to be a target for the TT diehards or the TT haters.

Ive tried very hard to upset neither side, over the years. Not my battle.

I wasn't asking for your personal preference, I thought as an experienced watcher of the establishment here you might have some insight into how it's going to pan out.

Personally I think its days are numbered, and the Irish issue has reduced that number.  My personal preference would be that some form of festival of motorcycling continues - the island has a buzz about it you don't see any other time - but the quest for ever faster laps should stop, it should be made safer, and sidecars should be scrapped.