TT 2023

[Numbnuts]

6 hours ago, Zarley said:

But surely they know enough to understand losing £160,000+ of taxpayers money due to a lack of due diligence means the CEO is incompetent? Why do we allow incompetent people to hold power over us? Why do we give in to bullies? Why can't we at least fine the incompetence? Maybe that would sharpen a few minds. 

I just don't understand why senior civil servants are bullet-proof. Something's got to give and I'm sick and tired of it always being ordinary people who do the giving.  

Hey I totally understand truthfully and how we always get hammered as tax payers. Personally , I don’t think they had a clue about the fact it would seem due diligence wasn’t done throughly or even at all. Should they have looked to make sure. Totally they should and with previous major cockups you’d have thought even the CM would have made sure all the boxes were ticked . Remember Vision 9 ! . So many more. Can anyone on here name a contract or scheme that has come in on budget and on time. Don’t think anyone can. 
many share your anger and frustrations but lots like me due to many issues have just almost given up with the continued issues. I so hope Manxman isn’t going to join the list but guessing many are thinking it is. 

Edited November 1, 2023 by Numbnuts

[Zarley]

Yep. I've just about given up too. If it weren't for my family, I totally would have by now. It's their future I worry about, not mine. 

[Numbnuts]

8 minutes ago, Zarley said:

Yep. I've just about given up too. If it weren't for my family, I totally would have by now. It's their future I worry about, not mine. 

And that exactly my reason. Sadly I don’t have kids or partner and as I’ve got older it’s clear we are banging our heads against a wall to no avail. I can only see a big big issue when the 15k people don’t come and money runs out. Let’s face it .

Boat issues , plane and airport issues , credit cards , doctors , dentists , waiting lists at hospital , postal services gone to hell. Gas prices , Electric costs, rental costs , new buy and general house prices , wastage from government on just about everything, lack of ability and willingness to change the culture and so much more. But the ordinary people despite all this are just wonderful. Pity the powers that be are so tarnished and lacking in so many ways. It’s broken in my opinion but it can be rescued. But will it. 

 

[Numbnuts]

Zarley, good to exchange views. Thanks for engaging 

[Non-Believer]

2 hours ago, Sheldon said:

Is it possible for a civil servant to be demoted, rather than moving relentlessly up a standard pay spine regardless of performance

Short answer, no. Once it's awarded it can't be taken away, except for in the case of dismissal for gross misconduct, part of PS T&Cs. The only sanction could be a sideways move or a generous "early retirement" package.

Plus the possibility that they've become so used to squandering huge sums of public money that it's no longer construed as an offence anyway. It's the new norm.

Edited November 1, 2023 by Non-Believer
Extra bit

[WTF]

3 hours ago, Zarley said:

What's stopping MHKs calling for him to do so? Is there a rule against them doing so, or is it just a case of "it's not the 'done' thing"?

nobody wants to topple the first domino 

[Zarley]

2 hours ago, Numbnuts said:

Zarley, good to exchange views. Thanks for engaging 

Yes, it's been good. Thank you too. 

[Zarley]

38 minutes ago, WTF said:

nobody wants to topple the first domino 

So it's as I suspected; theres no rule against, it's just not the "done thing". Fecking useless, the lot of them. 

[Max Power]

3 hours ago, Zarley said:

But surely they know enough to understand losing £160,000+ of taxpayers money due to a lack of due diligence means the CEO is incompetent? Why do we allow incompetent people to hold power over us? Why do we give in to bullies? Why can't we at least fine the incompetence? Maybe that would sharpen a few minds. 

I just don't understand why senior civil servants are bullet-proof. Something's got to give and I'm sick and tired of it always being ordinary people who do the giving.  

I'm pretty sure that the money owed to Government is commission on sales of merchandise for the use of the TT Logo etc? It's more a failure to realise income than money which has been paid out.

I think Mark Lewin is one of the good guys, I can't see him presiding over a major failure? There's plenty who are completely out of touch with reality but I wouldn't have said that he's one of them?

I can't speak for Cube or the DofE but I imagine that any amount of due diligence wouldn't show up that what appears to be a multi layered operation hasn't suddenly over stretched itself in one of its layers?   

[Roger Mexico]

3 hours ago, Zarley said:

Sounds to me like the person who really needs to resign is Lewin. Until the CEOs of dysfunctional departments are held accountable, nothing is ever going to change regardless of how many department ministers resign or get sacked.

Getting rid of ministers is shuffling deck chairs while the ship is sinking, when they should be fixing the engine. 

Actually if you look back over the last decade it's CEOs who have been the ones to be sacked when things go wrong.  Most Departments have lost one (DESC, DoI, DfE, DEFRA, Chief Sec) and DHSC has lost three, and that's not including the temp Magson.  Minister have not really been sacked for incompetence or mistakes - at best they've been transferred to an easier job when things got too hot.  Ministers are only sacked when they they annoy the civil service.

In fact CEOs are in some cases there as a sort of sacrificial shield to protect those who actually run the Department.  It's difficult to see why else they were appointed in some cases - Black for example had already demonstrated his incompetence and looking at some recent appointments you have to wonder.

And that's why nothing changes when such sackings take place.  The bad decisions are still made by the same people and there's probably even less control over them.  The bullying and favouritism and misplaced priorities go on and pet projects are pushed through with no regard to need or value.  The politicians reassure themselves that something has been done and nod everything through.  

In this particular case Chris Corlett was booted out over the Vision 9 debacle, but Phillips, who was the 'Mr 5%' behind the deal and stood to benefit personally, remained in place with subsequent promotions as do the others involved.

2 hours ago, Zarley said:

If Lewin had any self-respect he'd resign. What's stopping MHKs calling for him to do so? Is there a rule against them doing so, or is it just a case of "it's not the 'done' thing"?

It's not the 'done' thing.  Again you only have to the Vision 9 mess, where everyone did their best to keep the names quiet, though it was easily found with a bit of sleuthing.  Even the media are very reluctant to name the civil servants involved when things go wrong.

This is partly because of convention and the rules of Tynwald, but it's also because of the civil service omerta where criticism of each other never happens and action behind the scenes only does when the situation threatens other civil servants (as again happened with Vision 9).

[CrazyDave]

Pedant mode on.

There is no DFE CEO.

[Omobono]

22 hours ago, Roger Mexico said:

According to Wiki (which seems to be updated by a user called Gef the Mongoose) the magic roundabout of DfE has had the following Ministers this administration:

15/10/21 - 2/5/22  Alex Allinson

2/5/22 - 14/6/22  Alf Cannan

14/6/22 - 19/7/22  Tim Crookall

19/7/22 - 16/9/22  Alf Cannan

16/9/22 - 14/2/23  Lawrie Hooper

10/11/22 - date   Tim Johnston

This shows that Hooper was nominally in charge when the actual decisions were made to award to Cube Partnership in January but when they switched the contract after the failure of Cube Partnership it was under Johnston and he was also there when they tried to cover all this up.   They may not have been in charge during all the previous delays, but the final decisions will have been theirs.

Off with his head !

[Non-Believer]

Ashford claims during Keys coverage (3FM News) that just 10 minutes of his own online research proved that Cube was virtually insolvent at the time of their appointment as merchandise contractor.

[Roger Mexico]

1 hour ago, CrazyDave said:

Pedant mode on.

There is no DFE CEO.

Well Lewin's Linkedin says he's Chief Executive and given I was referring to them as a group, you'd be hard-pressed to say he isn't an Officer.  If you'd wanted to be pedantic you could have pointed out it was the DED when the Vision 9 fiasco happened.  The way things are going it's looking like another rebrand may be coming along.

[CrazyDave]

Just now, Roger Mexico said:

Well Lewin's Linkedin says he's Chief Executive and given I was referring to them as a group, you'd be hard-pressed to say he isn't an Officer.  If you'd wanted to be pedantic you could have pointed out it was the DED when the Vision 9 fiasco happened.  The way things are going it's looking like another rebrand may be coming along.

Then his LinkedIn needs updating.  There is only one CEO and it’s a rung above Lewin isn’t it?