Alf Cannan's I Have A Dream

[Boo Gay'n]

5 hours ago, Banker said:

People whining about deficit/use of reserves but still haven’t seen any solution to short term problems.

IOMG salary bill will go up by further £29m if healthcare jobs are filled but don’t expect people will whine then or maybe they will 😂

I am not sure if the answer produces a red herring though.  Almost all clinically essential roles will be covered by agency temps at a higher cost than salaries.  By that logic, the total MC expenditure would go down if the posts were filled.  Don't forget that the 'cost of locums and agency staff' has been cited for over a decade as one of the main causes of busting the budget at the DHSC!

[2112]

Minister of the DESC Julie Edge says on the Moanin Line that the DESC are considering a sixth form centre due to capacity issues in the East of the island. I thought the island had a sixth form college, namely the UCM. Has the island the funds to build? What about using existing resources, which aren’t overstretched, or maybe thinking outside the box, possibly using empty offices? 

[The Phantom]

5 minutes ago, 2112 said:

Minister of the DESC Julie Edge says on the Moanin Line that the DESC are considering a sixth form centre due to capacity issues in the East of the island. I thought the island had a sixth form college, namely the UCM. Has the island the funds to build? What about using existing resources, which aren’t overstretched, or maybe thinking outside the box, possibly using empty offices? 

We have a declining school population.  Which is worrying in itself. 

10 - 18 year olds, 800 - 900 every year. 

0 - 2 year olds.  600.  

Funds are irrelevant.  Build it and it will be empty in a few years. 

[Non-Believer]

8 minutes ago, The Phantom said:

We have a declining school population.  Which is worrying in itself. 

10 - 18 year olds, 800 - 900 every year. 

0 - 2 year olds.  600.  

Funds are irrelevant.  Build it and it will be empty in a few years. 

You're forgetting that the extra 15,000 people will include 5000 kids....instant full schools. 🤭

[The Phantom]

31 minutes ago, Non-Believer said:

You're forgetting that the extra 15,000 people will include 5000 kids....instant full schools. 🤭

5000 very tanned children with beards maybe. 

[Andy Onchan]

5 hours ago, Banker said:

Well Hooper does say restrictions on recruitment in admin jobs which is maybe why they’re outsourcing posting letters to post office 

They've done that before, it's not new.

[Harry Lamb]

2 hours ago, 2112 said:

Minister of the DESC Julie Edge says on the Moanin Line that the DESC are considering a sixth form centre due to capacity issues in the East of the island. I thought the island had a sixth form college, namely the UCM. Has the island the funds to build? What about using existing resources, which aren’t overstretched, or maybe thinking outside the box, possibly using empty offices? 

This comes up with monotonous regularity every few years - it was at one time promoted by Alf's father - and is a complete non-starter. Schools have a recruiting point offering potential staff sixth form teaching, which would vanish along with the staff. They won't transfer to a sixth form centre - if they wanted that, they could have it in UK with cheaper housing, nightlife etc. Sixth formers are role models (mostly) for younger pupils and act as a civilising influence. Costs would be prohibitive - think of the labs, sports facilities, workshops alone. Silly, even if rolls were growing, which they are not.

Edited October 2, 2023 by Harry Lamb

[Roxanne]

2 hours ago, Harry Lamb said:

This comes up with monotonous regularity every few years - it was at one time promoted by Alf's father - and is a complete non-starter. Schools have a recruiting point offering potential staff sixth form teaching, which would vanish along with the staff. They won't transfer to a sixth form centre - if they wanted that, they could have it in UK with cheaper housing, nightlife etc. Sixth formers are role models (mostly) for younger pupils and act as a civilising influence. Costs would be prohibitive - think of the labs, sports facilities, workshops alone. Silly, even if rolls were growing, which they are not.

The argument against has always been that it would create an ‘elite’ and all the best of the teachers would wish to work there with none of that ‘excellence’ filtering down to younger students. In these times of difficulties in recruiting, these crucial points are even more important. And yet, as you say, with each new administration, the same discussion keeps coming up…

[Happier diner]

2 hours ago, Harry Lamb said:

This comes up with monotonous regularity every few years - it was at one time promoted by Alf's father - and is a complete non-starter. Schools have a recruiting point offering potential staff sixth form teaching, which would vanish along with the staff. They won't transfer to a sixth form centre - if they wanted that, they could have it in UK with cheaper housing, nightlife etc. Sixth formers are role models (mostly) for younger pupils and act as a civilising influence. Costs would be prohibitive - think of the labs, sports facilities, workshops alone. Silly, even if rolls were growing, which they are not.

I remember when I was in 6th form. I certainly wasn't a role model. 😬

[Mercenary]

1 hour ago, Roxanne said:

The argument against has always been that it would create an ‘elite’ and all the best of the teachers would wish to work there with none of that ‘excellence’ filtering down to younger students. In these times of difficulties in recruiting, these crucial points are even more important. And yet, as you say, with each new administration, the same discussion keeps coming up…

Why not pay sixth form teachers less then?

[CrazyDave]

If they want to keep away from a sixth form college then they need to sort out the shit show that is the way they do things at the moment.

Kids expected to attend lessons at schools miles away from their own school but not allowed to drive themselves or get lifts with friends are regularly missing lessons because the schools can’t organise a bus, or even getting to a school miles away and finding the lesson is cancelled or there is no teacher.

It shouldn’t be difficult.

[Harry Lamb]

17 hours ago, Happier diner said:

I remember when I was in 6th form. I certainly wasn't a role model. 😬

Not in an acceptable direction, anyway  

[Roger Mexico]

21 hours ago, The Phantom said:

We have a declining school population.  Which is worrying in itself. 

10 - 18 year olds, 800 - 900 every year. 

0 - 2 year olds.  600.  

Funds are irrelevant.  Build it and it will be empty in a few years. 

It's worth pointing out just how dramatic this is.  Here are the figures for number of people by age from the May 2021 Census:

Age	Total
0	657
1	674
2	699
3	728
4	725
5	790
6	810
7	819
8	890
9	936
10	945
11	979
12	1025
13	919
14	918
15	884
16	901

Since then the number of births has continued to fall down to 586 in 2022.  So there are around a thousand 14 year-olds at the moment, and they must be panicking about what to do when those reach A-levels.  But the number then falls every year from then on. 

And of course families with children in education try not move to new areas if they can help it anyway, so all the blathering about the 'safe' Isle of Man is likely to attract is more grumpy pensioners demanding services and raising house prices so as to put off people with young families.

[Banker]

1 hour ago, Roger Mexico said:

It's worth pointing out just how dramatic this is.  Here are the figures for number of people by age from the May 2021 Census:

Age	Total
0	657
1	674
2	699
3	728
4	725
5	790
6	810
7	819
8	890
9	936
10	945
11	979
12	1025
13	919
14	918
15	884
16	901

Since then the number of births has continued to fall down to 586 in 2022.  So there are around a thousand 14 year-olds at the moment, and they must be panicking about what to do when those reach A-levels.  But the number then falls every year from then on. 

And of course families with children in education try not move to new areas if they can help it anyway, so all the blathering about the 'safe' Isle of Man is likely to attract is more grumpy pensioners demanding services and raising house prices so as to put off people with young families.

The ageing population is why we need younger people here, but as you say we need more affordable housing for them not big new estates with big expensive houses. Government really needs to get this sorted & build some with JV developers. The housing needs to be on some subsidized level both rental & purchase for both locals & new residents with the latter needing to stay minimum 7/10 years before selling & maybe clawback of part of rent if they leave within say2/3 years 

[Omobono]

Never mind ,  apparently  Government is  currently  considering  having an Education   management board , based on ,  and following the excellent example shown by the success of Manx  care to run and govern  the schools , 

I guess it will have the same credibility as the Health service has  this years exam results have already  lifted a few eyebrows ,and yet we are blindly following  the same mistake as heath and removing  the ministers and so called professionals  at the top  who literally have abrogated their responsibility  to someone else 

hence the  complete lack of decision making and failure to deliver a decent service