Please Sir can I have more!!

[Wavey Davey]

3 minutes ago, Asthehills said:

IT shortages?  Try sysadmin, DBA, CCISP, general infrastructure guys.

iT and actuarial were just the first two that popped into my head to make the point that it’s a staff shortage everywhere.

Exactly there is a huge range of employment shortages on the IOM across all sectors. School teachers need to grow up. If you don’t like it don’t call our bluff genuinely seek out a better paid job and see if it fulfills your needs. You’ll often be disappointed if you’re clocking time spent working and looking to be paid for work required to be done out of work hours. 

Edited September 25, 2022 by Wavey Davey

[HeliX]

24 minutes ago, Asthehills said:

Evidence?

There were no staffing issue in IT or actuarial pre pandemic?  Can you back that up with anything?

Two sectors does not "most other areas" make. I work in a profession that has been understaffed for more than a decade - pretty badly, too. Fortunately it's mostly private sector, so salaries were able to flex in accordance with this without the glacial speed of Government, nor dozens of pages on internet forums whinging about what we chose to pay our staff. Despite this, we're only just seeing the results of the salary increases now in terms of new blood coming into the profession. Because, like teaching, it takes years to train/qualify for. And we're still badly shortly staffed, meaning people who aren't really qualified end up in roles. Fortunately nothing bad really happens if my profession is short staffed, for the most part. Some companies make less money. Nothing on a societal scale, probably.

But if teaching is short staffed, it's a societal level problem. A generation (or several by the time this argument is done with and Govt has actually done something, and that has filtered back through into people's decisionmaking when they're leaving school) will be less well educated than they ought to have been. That will be bad for everyone, and bad for the country's GDP. Which will end up costing people more in tax/payments for things that tax would otherwise have covered.

So yeah, I would rather just pay a bit more towards teacher salaries now and hopefully avoid that. Never mind the acute problems that will occur if schools become so short-staffed that they can't stay open, which if we do nothing and people keep leaving teaching at a far higher rate than they are joining it, is not unlikely. And no, I couldn't really give a toss if people think that teachers get unfairly good treatment/pay as a result.

And yes, the same for other necessary professions like nurses, doctors, etc.

 

Edited September 25, 2022 by HeliX

[DrunkenMonkey]

31 minutes ago, Asthehills said:

Yep.  Same as every other industry.  You you teachers really need to stop thinking it’s an exclusive to teaching issue.

Not a teacher, didn't say it was exclusive.
We just seem to be in a thread about teaching so...

[Wavey Davey]

14 minutes ago, HeliX said:

So yeah, I would rather just pay a bit more towards teacher salaries now and hopefully avoid that. Never mind the acute problems that will occur if schools become so short-staffed that they can't stay open, which if we do nothing and people keep leaving teaching at a far higher rate than they are joining it, is not unlikely. And no, I couldn't really give a toss if people think that teachers get unfairly good treatment/pay as a result.

Stop threatening and act and honestly see if anyone gives a toss. 

[HeliX]

1 minute ago, Wavey Davey said:

Stop threatening and act and honestly see if anyone gives a toss. 

Happy to offer you the same 5grand bet of me not being a teacher.

[Wavey Davey]

2 minutes ago, HeliX said:

Happy to offer you the same 5grand bet of me not being a teacher.

Yes of course. 

[finlo]

8 minutes ago, HeliX said:

Happy to offer you the same 5grand bet of me not being a teacher.

Maybe not but the Mrs is though!

[HeliX]

4 minutes ago, finlo said:

Maybe not but the Mrs is though!

Nope. Nor any of my family.

[AcousticallyChallenged]

37 minutes ago, Wavey Davey said:

Exactly there is a huge range of employment shortages on the IOM across all sectors. School teachers need to grow up. If you don’t like it don’t call our bluff genuinely seek out a better paid job and see if it fulfills your needs. You’ll often be disappointed if you’re clocking time spent working and looking to be paid for work required to be done out of work hours. 

There is, and it’s a systemic problem. But, as well as all the other professions, we do need teachers to occupy all the little kiddos of those we want to be doing the other jobs. 

[AcousticallyChallenged]

42 minutes ago, Asthehills said:

IT shortages?  Try sysadmin, DBA, CCISP, general infrastructure guys.

iT and actuarial were just the first two that popped into my head to make the point that it’s a staff shortage everywhere.

 

Interestingly, there’s a huge IT shortage in the UK too as well as further overseas.

Guess what’s happened there, salaries for IT roles have shot up. 

[Asthehills]

14 minutes ago, AcousticallyChallenged said:

Interestingly, there’s a huge IT shortage in the UK too as well as further overseas.

Guess what’s happened there, salaries for IT roles have shot up. 

They are about to go up a further 5 to 8 percent for teachers as well, which would then be mirrored here.  Do try and keep up

[HeliX]

Just now, Asthehills said:

They are about to go up a further 5 to 8 percent for teachers as well, which would then be mirrored here.  Do try and keep up

Is that enough to fix the shortage? If not, what do you suggest?

Surely we at least agree that we need staffed schools, and ideally staffed by good teachers.

[manxman1980]

1 hour ago, Asthehills said:

IT shortages?  Try sysadmin, DBA, CCISP, general infrastructure guys.

iT and actuarial were just the first two that popped into my head to make the point that it’s a staff shortage everywhere.

 

So you are agreeing that salaries increase when there is a skills shortage and a continued demand for that particular skill set?

When people stop deciding to become teachers or leave because of the working conditions then it creates a shortage of competent,  qualified teachers.  

Clearly many of us on here agree that teaching isn't an attractive career path even with "all the holidays and short hours".  We have instead chosen careers in the private sector.

So what do we do to address this issue?  How do we ensure that the people teaching the next generation are skilled and competent enough to do so?  

The last thing the private sector needs is a load of poorly educated young people entering the workforce. 

Edited September 25, 2022 by manxman1980
Fixed a typo

[Asthehills]

3 minutes ago, HeliX said:

Is that enough to fix the shortage? If not, what do you suggest?

Surely we at least agree that we need staffed schools, and ideally staffed by good teachers.

We don’t know but need to give it time to see.  That is why the current action is so stupid.

[HeliX]

1 minute ago, Asthehills said:

We don’t know but need to give it time to see.  That is why the current action is so stupid.

If existing teachers aren't happy enough with it to stay and not strike, when they've clearly already got a vested interest in remaining in the teaching workforce, is it likely that it's attractive enough to new blood?