Please Sir can I have more!!

[Zarley]

59 minutes ago, Manx17 said:

She is the worst person to be put into the position she has been put in. When working at a high school. She would be in the kitchen taking joints of meat. Where there would not be enough for the students and some  would have to do without a Proper cooked meal. Probably for some their only cooked meal. Not only that she use to be there when a certain business rep came and he would go home with a meat joint too.
Get the teachers paid so students get an education like you did and your child did and if you don’t understand the importance of that maybe you need to step  down from the role your paid for. Never mind looking for 15000 educated people to come and move here. She needs sacked and her wages stopped every day the kids are off. 

Who are you talking about? I've gone back through the thread to see if I missed something,  but I'm none the wiser for it.

[HeliX]

18 minutes ago, Zarley said:

Who are you talking about? I've gone back through the thread to see if I missed something,  but I'm none the wiser for it.

Julie Edge is my guess, but it is a guess.

[Zarley]

14 hours ago, Asthehills said:

I don’t see that the rates for teachers are that bad when compared to other professions and taking into account all the benefits they get like fixed social hours and huge amounts of time off.

I would expect an equally experienced nurse working the hours they do and with the responsibility they have plus the inability to often take breaks etc to earn at least half as much again as a teacher for example.

"Fixed social hours and huge amounts of time off."

You've clearly not been paying attention. Teachers have a lot of work to do during that alleged "time off". Perhaps you should re-read the thread. "Fixed social hours" are also a figment of your imagination. 

Nurses are also underpaid, but you're comparing apples and oranges. Both are similar in that they are vitally important and foundational roles in a healthy, well balanced, equitable, prosperous and productive society. 

But they differ in subtle ways. For instance I'm not aware of any nurses who have to take paperwork home with them as teachers regularly do with marking and lesson planning. A lot of work goes into that aspect of the job. 

I'm also not aware of any nurses who have to provide materials for patients out of their own pockets. I am, however, aware of several teachers who provide materials for their students out of their own pockets and they tell me it's becoming an increasingly common practice in primary schools. I don't know about the secondary schools, but it wouldn't surprise me if it's happening there as well.

Edited September 21, 2022 by Zarley
Typo

[2bees]

Nothing would surprise me, there aren't many I'd trust not to be on a gypsy scam. This is an absolute disgrace, pay the teachers & get your fat faces out of the trough. 

Teachers are so important, even if they're not that great. If other government workers are being offered 3 or 4 % surely teachers deserve the same?

 

[Asthehills]

3 hours ago, Roxanne said:

Not a dig, more a comment about how you have normalised doing things that aren't in your job description and that your boss has allowed it to happen. Coming from a one time HR service, it's not something that is encouraged in the work place. Job descriptions came in to avoid staff being taken for granted.  That you are happy to do it means the it becomes expected, both for you and for other employees and, more importantly, for your boss. It sets an unprofessional precedent. 

I disagree.  The person who was meant to be doing it missed a flight home there was a van full from Friday afternoon.

What benefit to anyone is there if everyone just says “not my job”?

I don’t get it and it would never happen anywhere I have worked.  People always just muck in and help each other out as required.

[Asthehills]

3 hours ago, Roxanne said:

Just because it's expected, doesn't mean it is right. For too long employers have required 'extra' for no remuneration. Willing helpers only help to perpetuate it. Just watch the young ones coming up - they're not going to be coerced into it as us old ones have done all our working lives.

No coercion here.  I just like to help others as I would expect others to help me if needed.

IMO that is a healthy workplace.  You obviously disagree which is fair enough.

[HeliX]

21 minutes ago, Asthehills said:

No coercion here.  I just like to help others as I would expect others to help me if needed.

IMO that is a healthy workplace.  You obviously disagree which is fair enough.

A healthy workplace is one where the staff are paid properly and given the appropriate amount of hours to do the job. 

[Asthehills]

8 minutes ago, HeliX said:

A healthy workplace is one where the staff are paid properly and given the appropriate amount of hours to do the job. 

That has no relevance to what I posted about helping colleagues out when things are busy or don’t go to plan.

Anyway.  I firmly believe that you do what is required on the day to help out when needed .  Others obviously think you stick strictly to your job description.

Incidentally, I have 12 people who report to me who I could have sent on the tip run that people have picked up on.  I didn’t, I just did it.

[manxman1980]

39 minutes ago, Asthehills said:

I disagree.  The person who was meant to be doing it missed a flight home there was a van full from Friday afternoon.

What benefit to anyone is there if everyone just says “not my job”?

I don’t get it and it would never happen anywhere I have worked.  People always just muck in and help each other out as required.

Surely what you are describing is an exceptional circumstance and not a daily or weekly occurrence?

If you were now expected to do that trip everyday, for no additional pay or benefits, in addition to your current duties would you be happy?

[HeliX]

4 minutes ago, Asthehills said:

That has no relevance to what I posted about helping colleagues out when things are busy or don’t go to plan.

Anyway.  I firmly believe that you do what is required on the day to help out when needed .  Others obviously think you stick strictly to your job description.

If it's a one-off or rarely, yes. If it's an ongoing expectation like it is for teachers, and you feel your pay and conditions don't reflect that ongoing experience to do more than you are contracted to do, no.

E: F;B

Edited September 21, 2022 by HeliX

[Gladys]

1 minute ago, Asthehills said:

That has no relevance to what I posted about helping colleagues out when things are busy or don’t go to plan.

Anyway.  I firmly believe that you do what is required on the day to help out when needed .  Others obviously think you stick strictly to your job description.

Incidentally, I have 12 people who report to me who I could have sent on the tip run that people have picked up on.  I didn’t, I just did it.

As long as it is ad hoc and not expected, I have no problem and would probably do the same, tbh.   It is when it becomes part of the job with no agreement or recognition that I would have a problem.  

[P.K.]

This appears to be panning out to those in the private sector with a work ethic that feeds their bottom line and keeps everyone in employment versus those in the public sector on a cushty number and no bottom line at all that need concern one....

Yes teachers can do a lot of stuff in their spare time but let's face it they get plenty of it. In the private sector you do extra stuff because if there's a job to be done you just get on with it because it needs doing.

Culturally they are literally worlds apart.

Yes we need teachers, nurses, firemen, politicians etc but equally we need a private sector to fund them. Public servants do have a tendency to forget why they are there and who funds them. Personally I blame no bottom line for their lack of focus.

[manxman1980]

@P.K that is nonsense.  I work in the private sector but support those in the public sector getting a fair deal particularly teachers, nurses, and social workers.

[AcousticallyChallenged]

Of course, there’s the age old “pay peanuts, get monkeys”. 

Do you really want those spending more time in a week with your children than you might to be the lowest bidders? Or do you want more teachers who go the extra mile to help your little Jimmy?

Do you want the ones looking after you in hospital to be overworked, underpaid and stressed beyond belief?

There are some wonderful teachers and nurses out there, but if they got a fair deal, you can bet there would be a lot more. 

[P.K.]

8 minutes ago, manxman1980 said:

@P.K that is nonsense.  I work in the private sector but support those in the public sector getting a fair deal particularly teachers, nurses, and social workers.

Don't forget when public servants ask for a payrise they are also asking the private sector to generate more revenue to pay for it. But it sort-of remains unsaid.

It's certainly not nonsense when you take the argument to it's inevitable conclusion to wit:

Put a value on what all those in the public sector do...?

How about starting with members of Tynwald and nurses.

Show ALL working!

(Time to start juggling those monkeys...)