Happier diner Posted October 21, 2023 Share Posted October 21, 2023 13 minutes ago, Two-lane said: Who's paying? Is an NEC contract manager involved? Satisfaction guaranteed part of the contract? Satisfaction is not guaranteed. Only the costs. 🤣 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gladys Posted October 21, 2023 Share Posted October 21, 2023 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Happier diner said: There were no opportunities to end without breaching the contract. You can terminate a contract but you cannot remove yourself from the terms you signed up to. It's a NEC3 Option B. Cost reimbursable. Therefore you become liable for the all the costs associated with termination. That could extend as far as the contractor making staff redundant. Of course if you do that you have no ferry terminal. I'm not saying whether to DOI were right or wrong to persevere, only explaing how it works. If you don' t believe me the you can look for yourself. Just Google NEC 3 contract . Option B. Based upon bill of quantities. It surprisingly not that complicated. You can come to your conclusion. Conclusions have have come to for over 30 years. what room shall we have. 😄😄 Of course you can't terminate a contract without honouring the terms. I am not saying that should have happened, but when the changes to requirements become so significant, there is scope for a variation of terms. There may have been a point when termination was cheaper than continuing with a bottomless pit of a project. No, you wouldn't have a ferry terminal, but you would have several millions in the bank and there would be other places to call home near Liverpool. ETA I would prefer a room with a nice view of the Mersey. Edited October 21, 2023 by Gladys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cissolt Posted October 21, 2023 Share Posted October 21, 2023 5 hours ago, Happier diner said: The DOI do what they are told. What else can they do? They are a department of government, where else can they get money? In a large civil contract you have no option to pay, if you did not pay you would be in breach of contract. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-isle-of-man-57936743 You seem to have a short memory. The DOI threw a last minute request for more money through at the last minute to avoid scrutiny and pressure mhks to make the decision. Chris Thomas or the other minister stated in Tynwald that there were opportunities to pull the project early on that were missed. It's all on Hansard. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cueey Lewis And The News Posted October 21, 2023 Share Posted October 21, 2023 11 minutes ago, cissolt said: Chris Thomas or the other minister stated in Tynwald that there were opportunities to pull the project early on that were missed. It's all on Hansard. Thomas said they had, had three opportunities to pull out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asitis Posted October 21, 2023 Share Posted October 21, 2023 33 minutes ago, Cueey Lewis And The News said: Thomas said they had, had three opportunities to pull out. How many times has that proved very costly ! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoTail Posted October 21, 2023 Share Posted October 21, 2023 44 minutes ago, Cueey Lewis And The News said: Thomas said they had, had three opportunities to pull out. I had a girlfriend like that 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happier diner Posted October 21, 2023 Share Posted October 21, 2023 3 hours ago, cissolt said: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-isle-of-man-57936743 You seem to have a short memory. The DOI threw a last minute request for more money through at the last minute to avoid scrutiny and pressure mhks to make the decision. Chris Thomas or the other minister stated in Tynwald that there were opportunities to pull the project early on that were missed. It's all on Hansard. The DOI are minor pawns in this mess. They can't pay the bills with monopoly money. The government pull the strings, they can choose to terminate and they have had that choice the whole time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gladys Posted October 21, 2023 Share Posted October 21, 2023 2 minutes ago, Happier diner said: The DOI are minor pawns in this mess. They can't pay the bills with monopoly money. The government pull the strings, they can choose to terminate and they have had that choice the whole time. But who briefs and recommends to government (whoever that is in this)? DOI is part of government, as is Treasury and the Minister of the time. DOI were not minor pawns but the commissioning and supervising department, were they not? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred the shred Posted October 21, 2023 Share Posted October 21, 2023 Let us hope the landing stage gets a lot of use for the next 99 years . The new worry is that Heysham now want one, been in talks with Alfie and Comin according to the press they are obviously fans of the me too brigade. I don’t know why the Government are even in talks with them it is just giving them false hope far better to just tell them no chance from the start. To get took and shook once is unfortunate but to get took an shook twice would be a bridge, or landing stage, too far. The MP says the one in place is scruffy and is giving visitors to the Island a bad impression. Tough just tough. Must think we are a soft touch I wonder where he got this idea from 🤣. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GD4ELI Posted October 22, 2023 Share Posted October 22, 2023 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beelzebub3 Posted October 22, 2023 Share Posted October 22, 2023 On 10/20/2023 at 4:56 PM, Happier diner said: It was a UK contractor that built the Liverpool ferry terminal. It was a UK consultant who designed it. It was a UK consultant that project managed it. It was a UK cost consultant. It was a UK quantity surveyor. It was a UK consultant that supervised the construction. And IOM government (taxpayer) financed without proper (any) scrutiny from any Treasury/ DOI management, so I would assume IOM government allowed all the UK contractors to overcharge what they liked without any comebacks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happier diner Posted October 22, 2023 Share Posted October 22, 2023 36 minutes ago, Beelzebub3 said: And IOM government (taxpayer) financed without proper (any) scrutiny from any Treasury/ DOI management, so I would assume IOM government allowed all the UK contractors to overcharge what they liked without any comebacks. Every cost that a contractor claims is assessed by the quantity surveyor (QS) who is independent. Once checked and assessed the NEC Project Manager ( also independent) scrutinises the claim and either approves it or rejects it. Unless they are all bent, what you suggest cannot be true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beelzebub3 Posted October 23, 2023 Share Posted October 23, 2023 20 hours ago, Happier diner said: Every cost that a contractor claims is assessed by the quantity surveyor (QS) who is independent. Once checked and assessed the NEC Project Manager ( also independent) scrutinises the claim and either approves it or rejects it. Unless they are all bent, what you suggest cannot be true. In reality do you think the money spent has been good value to the taxpayer of the IOM? if you do, you are part of the problem we have and are willing to accept being ripped off. Do you really believe that if PH or other major contractor were carrying out the same development it would have cost upwards of £100million? I think you know the answer to that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happier diner Posted October 23, 2023 Share Posted October 23, 2023 13 minutes ago, Beelzebub3 said: In reality do you think the money spent has been good to the taxpayer of the IOM? if you do, you are part of the problem we have and are willing to accept being ripped off. Do you really believe that if PH or other major contractor were carrying out the same development it would have cost upwards of £100million? I think you know the answer to that. Did I ever say that? Of course not. Who is PH? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beelzebub3 Posted October 23, 2023 Share Posted October 23, 2023 14 minutes ago, Happier diner said: Did I ever say that? Of course not. Who is PH? Peel Holdings the company who were originally going to build the terminal for free to allow access to the existing terminal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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