More uselessness from DBC

[Gizo]

There seems to be a lot of people who live in Douglas who still need Mummy to hold their hand and wipe their arse too.

Theres some real cretins about. 
 

Just fuckin recycle and shut the fuck up. 

[Happier diner]

7 minutes ago, Gizo said:

There seems to be a lot of people who live in Douglas who still need Mummy to hold their hand and wipe their arse too.

Theres some real cretins about. 
 

Just fuckin recycle and shut the fuck up. 

Or you could mind your own business maybe.

[majkul]

Ok, Miss Wells, will do as you say, when you say, from now on. You hope.

[majkul]

15 minutes ago, Gizo said:

There seems to be a lot of people who live in Douglas who still need Mummy to hold their hand and wipe their arse too.

Theres some real cretins about. 
 

Just fuckin recycle and shut the fuck up. 

Ok, Miss Wells, will do as you say, when you say, from now on. You hope.

[Roger Mexico]

54 minutes ago, Adam Jacko IOM said:

You do wonder about the actual rational judgement of the council and the council leader. 

Two articles on MR yesterday 

One was about the bin petition with the council publicly slagging off the petitioner and saying it “notes the author has made criticisms of the authority based on his own personal opinion, including some personal attacks on individuals” and adding “While we respect the right to petition they should be based on statements of fact rather than statements of opinion and misleading information” 

https://www.manxradio.com/news/isle-of-man-news/douglas-resident-creates-petition-to-bring-back-weekly-bin-collections/

The second is about the petitioners business which is really putting Douglas on the global tourism map and has just been featured in the National Geographic. 

https://www.manxradio.com/news/isle-of-man-news/hotel-owner-chuffed-at-national-geographic-mention/

Are they really that stupid to publicly attack and try to discredit someone who is clearly investing well into Douglas and helping IOM government and Visit IOM put Douglas on the map as a tourism venue just because they’re pissed off that someone dared not to agree with the way they went about the bin changes?

Well it's certainly true that you don't believe in 'statements of fact'.  This the wording of the petition:

The Douglas Borough Council has reduced the frequency of general waste collection from homes in Douglas from weekly to fortnightly.

The council, under the leadership of Councilor Claire Wells and supported ideologically by Councilor Falk Horning, decided to reduce the frequency of bin collections without properly considering the health and welfare of the residents of Douglas. Moreover, the council failed to conduct impact studies which properly considered the impact that a reduction in service would have on the wellbeing of Douglas residents and the environment, having instead relied on generic studies conducted elsewhere in the world.

Neither Councilor Claire Wells nor Councilor Falk Horning are qualified environmentalists or climate scientists and their ability to understand, assess and apply conclusions from studies conducted elsewhere in the world to the particular circumstances of Douglas and its residents is highly questionable.

Moreover, Councilor Claire Wells was appointed as council leader after being unopposed in the last election. Mrs Wells is making decisions which impact the lives of Douglas residents negatively despite having received zero votes in the Council elections. Councilor Horning, on the other hand, feels that he is justified in lecturing the public on environmental issues despite apparently having no relevant formal qualifications and having taken office with only 385 votes.

This petition calls on the Douglas Borough Council to either reinstate the weekly bin collection schedule with immediate effect or for Councilor Wells and Horning to resign.

Anyone reading this can see that it is is mostly personal attacks on Wells and Horning - and full of completely irrelevant stuff which just suggests the writer doesn't understand how democracy or politics works, as has been patiently explained on this topic numerous times, so I'm not going to repeat.  There's little about the effects of the reduced collection, even though it came in some time ago, just an unevidenced assertion that Douglas is somehow special and therefore what works in the rest of the world can be ignored. 

The overall effect is to weaken any valid criticism of the changes , because the whole thing looks like a personal vendetta and indeed most of the commenters on the petition ignore all this and make their own arguments or base what they say on their own experiences.

This is the statement from DBC as reported by Manx Radio:

In response Douglas Borough Council said it's aware of the petition and notes the author has made criticisms of the authority based on his own personal opinion, including some personal attacks on individuals.

It adds: "While we respect the right to petition they should be based on statements of fact rather than statements of opinion and misleading information.

"We want to say again that, while the majority of 12,000 Douglas households have adjusted well to the new service, we do want to help residents with genuine concerns and they should contact the waste services team if they cannot recycle or have limited recycling capacity."

This doesn't even mention the petitioner's name and just states that it is based on his personal opinion, which one would hope is true.  To think that this constitutes some sort of personal attack and that the first one (which mentions Wells and Horning in most paragraphs) doesn't, is so detached from reality that it suggests people haven't read them.

[Roger Mexico]

1 hour ago, majkul said:

No, round our way, it was the recycling that wasn't collected just before the weekend, they said the truck was full and they will be back on Monday, after the weekend. They also asked my wife if she can take all the boxes back in until the alternative day of collection. She left them out in the back lane, ready for when they next decide to collect.

So much for "provisions have been made" for the Christmas period.

Thanks for clearing that up (and HD for the FB posting).  Who could have expected there to be more bottles and cans over the Christmas period, eh?

Oddly enough this rather points to the success of the policy in general - people clearly have been increasing their recycling and the Corpy hasn't adjusted to cope with the switch away from general rubbish (which they must have collected OK).

[hissingsid]

TT week should be fun especially if it is hot.     The people who maintain that two weekly collections are fine probably live on the outskirts of the City with gardens not in apartments, of which there are many, in central and downtown Douglas.

[Adam Jacko IOM]

1 hour ago, Roger Mexico said:

Anyone reading this can see that it is is mostly personal attacks on Wells and

Most people probably wouldn’t read any of that as a personal attack and he hasn’t been insulting or rude. It’s merely what is called criticism which seems to be the one thing that Cllr Wells especially is totally incapable of taking on board. He’s perfectly valid in mentioning that nobody voted for her either as it’s factually correct and a very valid point about democracy in the decision making process.

As for the other bit. They refer to the petitioner in the other MR statement so it’s very clear who they are taking about as his name is actually on the petition. He’s also referred to on MR by name.

https://www.manxradio.com/news/isle-of-man-news/douglas-resident-creates-petition-to-bring-back-weekly-bin-collections/

Perhaps they thought it was another Karel Ver Elst they were ripping apart for daring to disagree with them It’s such a common Manx name after all. 

Edited January 8, 2023 by Adam Jacko IOM

[Two-lane]

59 minutes ago, Roger Mexico said:

Anyone reading this can see that it is is mostly personal attacks on Wells and Horning

I do not see anything in that statement that I would consider a personal attack. "Neither Councilor Claire Wells nor Councilor Falk Horning are qualified environmentalists or climate scientists" is a factual statement, and "their ability to understand, assess and apply conclusions from studies conducted elsewhere in the world to the particular circumstances of Douglas and its residents is highly questionable" is a reasonable conclusion to draw.

Comments about the number of votes they received is also factual.

 

1 hour ago, Roger Mexico said:

This doesn't even mention the petitioner's name and just states that it is based on his personal opinion, which one would hope is true.

That his name is not there is irrelevant - his name is at the top of the petition. They are clearly commenting on that person (c.f. ManxForums view on links - in this case they are commenting on an identifiable person, but simply not using his name explicitly).

For what it is worth, one of Ver Elst's hotels has made it into a copy of National Geographic. That makes his view signifiant in this context (in my opinion etc).

[I have no idea how this came about - lobbying, paid advert or whatever. But in comparison, no matter how much I paid a publisher, my house would not be centre-fold in House and Garden]

For Douglas Council to publicly criticise  Ver Elst is in my opinion not a personal attack, but it is politically naive or politically insensitive.

My interest in this section came from the press statement from DBC that petitions should not be based on opinion. I would still like to know who signed off the press release. Don't tell me it was from a spoofed email address.

 

[TheTeapot]

Isn't that Karel bloke a raving fucking nutter? Qtard antivax type? 

[Manxieover65]

1 hour ago, Roger Mexico said:

Thanks for clearing that up (and HD for the FB posting).  Who could have expected there to be more bottles and cans over the Christmas period, eh?

Oddly enough this rather points to the success of the policy in general - people clearly have been increasing their recycling and the Corpy hasn't adjusted to cope with the switch away from general rubbish (which they must have collected OK).

Come off it pal . Take a walk down streets when recycling is due in Douglas , I'd say at the very most it's 1 in  8 houses who do it 

[Manxieover65]

8 minutes ago, TheTeapot said:

Isn't that Karel bloke a raving fucking nutter? Qtard antivax type? 

Must be wrong about waste then 🙄

[Manxieover65]

2 hours ago, Gizo said:

There seems to be a lot of people who live in Douglas who still need Mummy to hold their hand and wipe their arse too.

Theres some real cretins about. 
 

Just fuckin recycle and shut the fuck up. 

Weird I got a warning for pointing out where a councillor came from , yet this guy can insult like this 🤔  . Is this because he's pro recycling its allowed 

Edited January 8, 2023 by Manxieover65
Wrong file

[Gladys]

32 minutes ago, Adam Jacko IOM said:

He’s perfectly valid in mentioning that nobody voted for her either as it’s factually correct and a very valid point about democracy in the decision making process.

 

It isn't a valid point at all.  Because she was returned unopposed does not impair her duties and obligations as a councillor, nor should it as we would have a tiered system of authority which would be bonkers.  She is Chairman and so the figurehead.  She did not make this decision alone, it was decided by the majority of councillors.  She was also elected as Chair by the councillors; she didn't automatically get the role.

I really do not know why this has become so focused on her, it is the decision of the councillors by a substantial majority.

You might as well attack all the others who voted for it, but that would tend to dilute the ire and vitupery, wouldn't it? 

[Zarley]

6 minutes ago, Manxieover65 said:

Come off it pal . Take a walk down streets when recycling is due in Douglas , I'd say at the very most it's 1 in  8 houses who do it 

If that's the case, perhaps it's the fault of the 7 in 8 households who can't be bothered to recycle that their bins are overflowing. Maybe they should be charged for any litter pick-up that needs to be done as a result.