The Bastard Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 (edited) 18 minutes ago, The Phantom said: It's not really the same though is it? Bore your car's cylinders out and it's still a motor car, just with a larger displacement. Add a motor to bicycle, then it becomes a motorbike. Something entirely different. Although I'll admit the pedal assist e-bikes is a bit of a grey area when it comes to pigeon-holing. As I've said, I think the current output limit is fine for assisting pedalling. More and then it definitely becomes more like a motorbike. Chipping them etc is realistically pretty rare, but it does happen. Bore your car out (or chip it and don't tell your insurer)- it's no longer insured and it's not taxed properly, so by your own choice you've made it illegal to drive. If you change the components on an e-bike so it's assisted past 15.5mph it's no longer legal, so the same thing, really. The output limit is fine for you, but the IOM doesn't base its legislation around you. Even at the moment, the law doesn't see powered bicycles as "motorcycles", that's just you. By your own admission you've only rode e-bikes a couple of times, so maybe you're not basing your decision on your experience of actually using them day-to-day, or on looking at how other groups could be encouraged on to active transport if they were more practical to use, like in the consultation. The L1E-A grouping in the proposal still has the same assistance threshold of 15.5mph, so they're not adding speed to the bike, just adding more torque for the hills so they're more of a practical proposition for the "hilly" island that someone was bleating about. You want to go faster than 15.5mph, and it's all on you and how hard you can pedal, rather than the power of the motor. 14 minutes ago, The Phantom said: I think we're entering semantics here. I bet Cowell and most people would describe it as an e-bike. Maybe, but it doesn't matter what the man in the pub thinks is an e-bike. There's a definition in law, which is definitive. Edited November 23, 2022 by The Bastard 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiVibes Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 22 minutes ago, Stu Peters said: I try not to respond to The Vibrator, but as an old dodderer I can't resist. My lovely gas-guzzling German V8 is limited to 155mph too. So I'm thinking of having it chipped to remove that... Yeah, get a bus... https://www.express.co.uk/life-style/cars/1624664/elderly-drivers-road-traffic-collision-failed-look-crash-study Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Phantom Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 1 minute ago, The Bastard said: Bore your car out - it's no longer insured and it's not taxed, so by your own choice you've made it illegal to drive. If you change the components on an e-bike so it's assisted past 15.5mph it's no longer legal, so the same thing, really. The output limit is fine for you, but the IOM doesn't base its legislation around you. Even at the moment, the law doesn't see powered bicycles as "motorcycles", that's just you. By your own admission you've only rode e-bikes a couple of times, so maybe you're not basing your decision on your experience of actually using them, or on looking at how other groups could be encouraged on to active transport if they were more practical to use, like in the consultation. The L1E-A grouping in the proposal still has the same assistance threshold of 15.5mph, so they're not adding speed to the bike, just adding more torque for the hills so they're more of a practical proposition for the "hilly" island that someone was bleating about. You want to go faster than 15.5mph, and it's all on you and how hard you can pedal, rather than the power of the motor. Ah ok fair point on the modification and insurance voiding on your car. Yeah I've ridden them maybe a bit more than a couple of times, but that has been both on road and in serious off road mountain bike terrain. I'll more than likely get one in a few years, but at the moment I'm still fit enough to ride normally. A couple of friends that I ride with regularly have them, we even sometimes use them for tow assist up hills and greenlanes for us non e-bikers. Trust me, I've got a better 'feel' of them than 99% of people. The current status regarding the output is fine, if you need more assistance than that to get up a steep hill, you probably shouldn't be on a bike in the first place. The assistance provided is more than sufficient for people of average fitness. I honestly think increasing the output wouldn't attract anyone else onto them that wouldn't consider one in the first place. Same as the active travel Govt bullshit strategy. Unless Govt somehow provided a financial or speed (i.e. commute time) incentive. You're either active or your not. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Johnson Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 As I have said before, the island is TOO HILLY for cycling to become a "thing" Wherever you see lots of bikes it is always a flat country/ town etc. York, Cambridge, Norwich etc etc etc London, round the middle bit there are just no hills like Lord St. Victoria Street, or Summerhill. Roger can quote all he likes about heights on maps near city centres but the fact remains that Douglas is on a cliff face, look at Victoria St/ Prospect Hill and the rest of the island is not much better. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Two-lane Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 27 minutes ago, Stu Peters said: My lovely gas-guzzling German V8 is limited to 155mph too. So I'm thinking of having it chipped to remove that... Is that a serious comment? If so, where do you intend to drive at > 155mph? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happier diner Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 3 minutes ago, Boris Johnson said: As I have said before, the island is TOO HILLY for cycling to become a "thing" Wherever you see lots of bikes it is always a flat country/ town etc. York, Cambridge, Norwich etc etc etc London, round the middle bit there are just no hills like Lord St. Victoria Street, or Summerhill. Roger can quote all he likes about heights on maps near city centres but the fact remains that Douglas is on a cliff face, look at Victoria St/ Prospect Hill and the rest of the island is not much better. e bikes? The answer. Where have you been? 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happier diner Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 3 minutes ago, Two-lane said: Is that a serious comment? What do you think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Johnson Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 28 minutes ago, Stu Peters said: I try not to respond to The Vibrator, but as an old dodderer I can't resist. My lovely gas-guzzling German V8 is limited to 155mph too. So I'm thinking of having it chipped to remove that... BTW I didn't know Clive except to say hello to. And where would you use that speed Stu, even if you were able to control it at your age with your slowed reactions due to your age? FFS Think of the people who have to drive for a living, that have to use the roads to earn a living, nevermind the DOI guys working on the roads. They don't need an OAP with a 180 mph car trying to relive their youth. Seriously, how do you think doing more than 155 mph is a good thing? In fact how do you think doing more than 60 mph on the islands roads is sensible with our type of roads? As in not designed, just old tracks tarmaced over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Johnson Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Happier diner said: e bikes? The answer. Where have you been? Which defeats the health bit of "active whatever" policy Every e bike I have ridden has been a Chinese type and they are basically electric mopeds. When you see a Police car you pretend to pedal................... ETA I have got one and bought 250W stickers from ebay to put in place of the 1000w sticker on the hub. I get more exercise cleaning the thing than I do zipping about town on it................. Edited November 23, 2022 by Boris Johnson 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiVibes Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 7 minutes ago, Boris Johnson said: the fact remains that Douglas is on a cliff face, look at Victoria St/ Prospect Hill and the rest of the island is not much better. Playing the Dame this panto season? 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiVibes Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 1 hour ago, Two-lane said: Is that a serious comment? If so, where do you intend to drive at > 155mph? I am sure we could come up with a few suggestions... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cambon Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 1 hour ago, Two-lane said: Is that a serious comment? If so, where do you intend to drive at > 155mph? They don't make special Noddy style cars just for the I.o.M., you know! Germany's autobahns and many other roads in Europe and worldwide allow much higher speeds than you obviously feel safe driving at. I suggest you don't ever leave the island again. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hissingsid Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 We have hills, a lot of them, very steep hills that is the difference between us and Holland. This puts the average person off pedal power, not the wind or the cold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hissingsid Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 As for E bikes they are very expensive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiVibes Posted November 23, 2022 Share Posted November 23, 2022 3 minutes ago, Cambon said: They don't make special Noddy style cars just for the I.o.M., you know! Germany's autobahns and many other roads in Europe and worldwide allow much higher speeds than you obviously feel safe driving at. I suggest you don't ever leave the island again. It's more we don't feel safe you driving those speeds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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