DOI fails again

[Ativa]

40 minutes ago, doc.fixit said:

I live down North and have all of those issues!! Well I would if we didn't have a car or relatives close by.

How does the connect service help? It does not run in our village. Even if it did the luggage issue remains. 

If it ran in your village (say Andreas or Jurby) then you just book your own private mini bus from where you want to where you want as far as Ramsey bus station and pay a bus fare rather than a taxi fare.

I have no idea if pensioners get it for free.  There should be plenty of room for shopping etc on a 14 seat minibus with no one else on it.

I work up north fairly regularly and see them picking up and dropping off at Shoprite, The Trafalger, The Commercial etc.

Extending that service would see a massive upturn in use and a riot from the taxi drivers.

[Albert Tatlock]

1 hour ago, Ringy Rose said:

If you want to tempt people out of their cars, frequency is important.

You’re tempting nobody out of cars with half hour waits.

There’s also capacity. The south buses are pretty full as it is at 3 buses an hour, they really could do with the 4th one going back in unless they’re going to only use double deckers.

Whoever thinks people are going to drive a car from home for 10 mins, wait 10mins for a train, travel 30 mins on a train, hop on a horsetram, hop on a bus for 10 mins, then walk 10 mins in the pissing rain to work, then do it all in reverse with a bag of shopping at night - they need their bumps felt...

...including any element of that in between.

Ain't happening, won't  happen.

Too many people here live in dreamland.

[Declan]

3 hours ago, Albert Tatlock said:

Whoever thinks people are going to drive a car from home for 10 mins, wait 10mins for a train, travel 30 mins on a train, hop on a horsetram, hop on a bus for 10 mins, then walk 10 mins in the pissing rain to work, then do it all in reverse with a bag of shopping at night - they need their bumps felt...

...including any element of that in between.

Ain't happening, won't  happen.

Too many people here live in dreamland.

But that's his point! People won't use public transport if it is too inconvenient.

I live two minutes from the bus stop, my office has a stop outside. On the way home I walk past the Co-op so I can get my bits & pieces then. I don't have off street parking at home or at work, so the difference between walking to the bus and a parked car is minimal. So provided the bus is regular, reliable and comfortable - it's a more convenient option.

Pretty much everything I need for basic survival - pubs, record and book shops, food shops, takeaways, gyms, doctors, chemists are within walking distance of home or office. And if I break my bus journey there's more options on my route.

Obviously that won't be the same for everyone and the modern world is constructed to be reliant on the motorcar (out of town workplaces, superstores, schools that won't let parents drop their kids off in the playground before ten to nine). Even for an outlier like me there are days (maybe once a month) when driving would be more convenient.

However, if by having an efficient public transport (and here that means the bus network) serving as many people as possible then more people on more occasions will choose public transport because it's more convenient at that moment. And if initiatives like the 15 minute town succeed that will reduce the occasions when people need to travel beyond walking distance. 

That's got to be a good thing? Some people choosing to walk or use public transport because it is less hassle for them is good for their quality of life. Meanwhile those that have to or choose to continue driving have a better driving experience because there are fewer cars on the road and less competition for parking.

[HiVibes]

On 4/5/2023 at 9:03 AM, Gladys said:

So what it has demonstrated is that the price is not the bar to increased usage, so it must be something else. Possibly timetable and routes. 

Or the obvious that most journeys were under the cap already.

Edited April 6, 2023 by HiVibes

[CallMeCurious]

30 minutes ago, Declan said:

But that's his point! People won't use public transport if it is too inconvenient.

I live two minutes from the bus stop, my office has a stop outside. On the way home I walk past the Co-op so I can get my bits & pieces then. I don't have off street parking at home or at work, so the difference between walking to the bus and a parked car is minimal. So provided the bus is regular, reliable and comfortable - it's a more convenient option.

Pretty much everything I need for basic survival - pubs, record and book shops, food shops, takeaways, gyms, doctors, chemists are within walking distance of home or office. And if I break my bus journey there's more options on my route.

Obviously that won't be the same for everyone and the modern world is constructed to be reliant on the motorcar (out of town workplaces, superstores, schools that won't let parents drop their kids off in the playground before ten to nine). Even for an outlier like me there are days (maybe once a month) when driving would be more convenient.

However, if by having an efficient public transport (and here that means the bus network) serving as many people as possible then more people on more occasions will choose public transport because it's more convenient at that moment. And if initiatives like the 15 minute town succeed that will reduce the occasions when people need to travel beyond walking distance. 

That's got to be a good thing? Some people choosing to walk or use public transport because it is less hassle for them is good for their quality of life. Meanwhile those that have to or choose to continue driving have a better driving experience because there are fewer cars on the road and less competition for parking.

So is the 15 minute town, 15 minutes there and back or 30 minutes there and back?
At an average walking pace of 3 mph then 15 minutes equates to 0.75 miles radius (1.5 square miles).

Within a 15 minute walk there will be a GP surgery, a dental practise, a chemist, an opticians, a nursery, a primary school, a secondary school, a cottage hospital, a college, a solicitor (2 at least), a funeral parlour, an estate agent, a supermarket, a hardware store, a pub, a restaurant, a cinema, a gym, a sports pitch, a swimming pool, a bus station, a hotel, a bank, a post office, an off license, a nursing home, a park, a shoe shop, a clothes shop, housing, a coffee shop, a police station, a library, a playground, a recycling centre, a museum, a theatre, a farmers market, plumbers, electricians, a garden centre, bricklayers, hair dressers...

For example, Ramsey has a population 8,288 and an area of 1.5 square miles and has most of the above facilties yet how many residents have jobs in Ramsey alone and how many who work in Ramsey live there? 

So is Ramsey a 15 minute town?

 

 

[Declan]

I think it's aimed more at neighbourhoods within cities and larger towns, because in the centre of places like Ramsey, Peel, Port Erin it more or less exists.

So in a Manx context it would be building on brown field sites in Douglas where people can access takeaways, shops, gps, schools, pubs, cafes  after a short walk. Rather than more and more estates in Braddan where you need to drive to access those facilities.

[Roger Mexico]

18 minutes ago, CallMeCurious said:

For example, Ramsey has a population 8,288 and an area of 1.5 square miles and has most of the above facilties yet how many residents have jobs in Ramsey alone and how many who work in Ramsey live there? 

The most recent figures are from the 2016 Census and it showed that 55% of those who lived in Ramsey and were employed also worked in Ramsey.  They made up 63% of those who are employed in the town.

Ramsey was actually the only LA area where considerably more residents work locally rather than in Douglas (only 32% of Ramsey workers are based there).  Only Bride (just) had more locals and that was only about 50 local v Douglas, despite the distance.  And of course 82% of Douglas residents also work there.

[Declan]

11 minutes ago, Roger Mexico said:

The most recent figures are from the 2016 Census and it showed that 55% of those who lived in Ramsey and were employed also worked in Ramsey.  They made up 63% of those who are employed in the town.

Ramsey was actually the only LA area where considerably more residents work locally rather than in Douglas (only 32% of Ramsey workers are based there).  Only Bride (just) had more locals and that was only about 50 local v Douglas, despite the distance.  And of course 82% of Douglas residents also work there.

Also the switch to hybrid working means that many based in Douglas will spend a chunk of their working week in their home neighbourhoods.

[Ativa]

Had a rare trip on the bus this morning.

Baking hot, cramped seats, smelly and bumpy and took ages.

They are going to have to do something major to encourage people who have cars to switch to public transport.  From leaving the house to getting to my destination took twice as long as it would have done to just drive.

A thoroughly unpleasant experience compared to driving, and I had to walk to the stop and then from the stop to where I wanted to be at the other end.  If it has been raining I would have been soaked.

[Gladys]

19 minutes ago, Ativa said:

Had a rare trip on the bus this morning.

Baking hot, cramped seats, smelly and bumpy and took ages.

They are going to have to do something major to encourage people who have cars to switch to public transport.  From leaving the house to getting to my destination took twice as long as it would have done to just drive.

A thoroughly unpleasant experience compared to driving, and I had to walk to the stop and then from the stop to where I wanted to be at the other end.  If it has been raining I would have been soaked.

That's buses for you; never the luxury option, but you knew that before you decided to go on a journey. 

[2112]

30 minutes ago, Ativa said:

Had a rare trip on the bus this morning.

Baking hot, cramped seats, smelly and bumpy and took ages.

They are going to have to do something major to encourage people who have cars to switch to public transport.  From leaving the house to getting to my destination took twice as long as it would have done to just drive.

A thoroughly unpleasant experience compared to driving, and I had to walk to the stop and then from the stop to where I wanted to be at the other end.  If it has been raining I would have been soaked.

What was the driver like? Pleasant and helpful or Unpleasant? What were the passengers like? Sometimes you can hit lucky, a nice bus driver and great passengers, some even know how to use a bar of soap. 

[2112]

14 minutes ago, Gladys said:

That's buses for you; never the luxury option, but you knew that before you decided to go on a journey. 

Sadly most public transport is like that, even in the UK it’s no different, except you can get Uber Taxis, unlike the IOM. 

[Non-Believer]

15 minutes ago, Gladys said:

That's buses for you; never the luxury option, but you knew that before you decided to go on a journey. 

I find the buses pretty good (as they should be for the investment). Reasonably clean, modern, most are WiFi equipped, we could have a lot worse.

[2112]

Just now, Non-Believer said:

I find the buses pretty good (as they should be for the investment). Reasonably clean, modern, most are WiFi equipped, we could have a lot worse.

Most train companies in the UK have Wi-Fi, I don’t know whether there is Wi-Fi on the buses here? 

[offshoremanxman]

On 4/7/2023 at 1:28 AM, Declan said:

Also the switch to hybrid working means that many based in Douglas will spend a chunk of their working week in their home neighbourhoods.

Hybrid working in the IOM makes me laugh. People who can’t be arsed with a 10 minute drive to work. Most companies are stopping it as it’s basically laughable. Loads in government still doing it though, what a surprise.