AcousticallyChallenged Posted July 16, 2023 Share Posted July 16, 2023 21 hours ago, Panopticon said: Thanks for referring me to the "fluoride action network" where I see there is an interesting excerpt from the book My point, that you may have missed, is that a source like the Fluoride Action Network is not exactly going to publish anything that doesn't validate their views. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AcousticallyChallenged Posted July 16, 2023 Share Posted July 16, 2023 8 hours ago, genericUserName said: I am opposed to the government putting flouride in water. Unfortunately however - much of the anti-flouride lobby come across as being fairly similar in tone, presentation and outlook to the anti-vaxxers. Which does not help. It's almost tribal, but then again, everyone wants a community. Some are into model trains, some go swimming in groups, some play in bands, some go for a bit of medical quackery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panopticon Posted August 10, 2023 Share Posted August 10, 2023 On 7/16/2023 at 10:06 PM, AcousticallyChallenged said: My point, that you may have missed, is that a source like the Fluoride Action Network is not exactly going to publish anything that doesn't validate their views. Your assertion is based on a classic logical fallacy and is a rhetorical device. I usually refer to Robert Thouless's "Straight and Crooked Thinking" but as these days people seem to want online references I suppose they could refer to https://www.softschools.com/examples/fallacies/circumstantial_ad_hominem_examples/522/ "Circumstantial Ad Hominem occurs when someone attacks a claim by saying that the person making the claim is only making it because it's in his/her interest or because of his/her circumstances. This actually has no bearing on whether or not the claim is true or false." or https://informationisbeautiful.net/visualizations/rhetological-fallacies/ "Circumstance Ad Hominem Stating a claim lacks credibility only because of the advocate’s interests in their claim." There are others e.g. the now rather dated in terms of definitions but amusing http://whale.to/m/disin.html Your assertion seems also to be potentially defamatory by innuendo since it implies the fluoride action network would (dishonestly) suppress studies which do not align with their "agenda". I have no idea if they have done so but assume it somewhat unlikely since it would not advance their cause. I am like most everyone else here I suspect, interested in facts and data from either side so long as they advance understanding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panopticon Posted August 10, 2023 Share Posted August 10, 2023 On 7/16/2023 at 10:07 PM, AcousticallyChallenged said: It's almost tribal, but then again, everyone wants a community. Some are into model trains, some go swimming in groups, some play in bands, some go for a bit of medical quackery. As for "anti-vaxxer" that is just another neural disrupter / weaponised phrase / smear and imo invoked to shut down critical thinking: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thought-terminating_cliché Some might also place it under: "Guilt by Association Discrediting an idea or claim by associating it with an undesirable person or group." - but so-called anti-vaxxers appear to be no more untrustworthy than those who promoted the "experimental" COVID-19 shots; so FAIL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anyone Posted August 10, 2023 Share Posted August 10, 2023 I love fluoride , I put it in my cornflakes. Yummy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panopticon Posted August 10, 2023 Share Posted August 10, 2023 This thread is pretty much complete and if as it should, the precautionary principle applies, imo all we - and Government - need do is await the outcome of the trial in the U.S. where the expert testimony will be turned over in detail. Anyone new to the thread can also refer back to the link posted 5th June viz https://www.ukfffa.org.uk/boris-johnson-letter-december-2021 - click on the green lettered box to download the pdf and read in particular page 2 and especially the criticisms of the Policy Paper (UK) and the fact it ignored later but then existing studies which contradicted its authors' recommendations. However I came back to post this as it seemed potentially helpful - retired dental academic Ellie Phillips on use of Xylitol interviewed by Dr Peter McCullough. (Do-Your-Own-Research!) https://www.americaoutloud.news/power-of-xylitol-in-dentistry/ - I think McCullough terming her a maverick is a bit OTT, her reference to natural remineralisation is old hat e.g. the phenomenon of the brown spot lesion; @37m she says she does not support water fluridation but is OK with topical use / rinse. I don't have any training in the field but unless shown otherwise I would potentially disagree with her over use of toothpaste - if it contains glycerine, does that inhibit remineralisation? Also you can probably dispense with toothpaste if you use an Ionic toothbrush (that is, in my experience). Interesting remarks about flossing - again D-Y-O-R. You can just get Xylitol bagged in the supermarket (though presumably check its glycemic index if diabetic?) https://www.youtube.com/@dr.elliephillips/videos See short videos on Xylitol use e.g. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rq9UE63v2Aw Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillyNoMates Posted August 11, 2023 Share Posted August 11, 2023 nevemind flouride i want to be able to see a bleedin g nhs dentist 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADELE Posted August 11, 2023 Share Posted August 11, 2023 I have had to go private it is fairly expensive but worth it . It depends on priorities I expect something else has to go it is not easy these days to keep all the balls in the air. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happier diner Posted August 11, 2023 Share Posted August 11, 2023 13 hours ago, Anyone said: I love fluoride , I put it in my cornflakes. Yummy. Yes you do. Milk contains fluoride and soya milk contains a lot of fluoride. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chinahand Posted August 13, 2023 Share Posted August 13, 2023 On 8/11/2023 at 12:42 PM, Happier diner said: Yes you do. Milk contains fluoride and soya milk contains a lot of fluoride. Green tea, too. Great source of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted August 13, 2023 Share Posted August 13, 2023 Great! Don't need to sully the water with it then. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AcousticallyChallenged Posted August 14, 2023 Share Posted August 14, 2023 On 8/10/2023 at 10:11 PM, Panopticon said: I am like most everyone else here I suspect, interested in facts and data from either side so long as they advance understanding. Then, cite peer-reviewed journal papers. If there aren't any, some will claim it's a cover-up, others would say those papers don't pass scientific muster. On 8/10/2023 at 10:12 PM, Panopticon said: As for "anti-vaxxer" that is just another neural disrupter / weaponised phrase / smear and imo invoked to shut down critical thinking: Actually, it sums up the people who are convinced that some sort of electronic implant could be fit into the needle for the COVID jab. The real ones are much bigger. You'd certainly not miss it going in. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panopticon Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 Details of the upcoming trial with expert witnesses in District Court, N.D. California scheduled to be commencing 29 January 2024: http://momsagainstfluoridation.org/fluoridation-trial-press-kit "A two week trial will begin on January, 29th and will continue for approximately 2 weeks. District Court for the Northern District of California in San Francisco. This trial may be held on Zoom and that will be determined in the fall of 2023 [munged, presumably sc.: 2024]. Food & Water Watch, Inc. v. Environmental Protection Agency (3:17-cv-02162) https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/6201332/food-water-watch-inc-v-environmental-protection-agency/?page=3 Parties' lawyers: https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/6201332/parties/food-water-watch-inc-v-environmental-protection-agency/ http://momsagainstfluoridation.org/fluoridation-trial-press-kit "Details (phone and video) for accessing the virtual trial will be available on Judge Edward Chen's page": https://apps.cand.uscourts.gov/CEO/cfd.aspx?7144 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anyone Posted January 8 Share Posted January 8 I love fluoride , I have it in my rum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panopticon Posted January 22 Share Posted January 22 https://www.manxradio.com/podcasts/manx-radio-update/8159.mp3 10 January 2024 @12:13 - Iain Mack about his petition against water fluoridation. He encourages everyone to do their own research. https://www.nofluorideinmanxwater.org (Another view: just wait for the outcome of the US trial - whenever that is). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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