Ban On Violent Net Porn Planned

[Lonan3]

There are two points that seem to be missing so far.

The first is that pornography has been around in some form or other ever since humans learned how to create images. Some of the temple images on ancient Indian temples are as explicit as anything that can be seen on video/DVD today; Roman emperors commissioned statuary with the specific intent of being aroused by them, and even the straitlaced Victorians spent fortunes on obtaining pornography.

Secondly, it is also a fact that many females find pornography arousing. Probably not as many as men, but it is difficult to be certain because there is still a kind of reluctance to admit to it.

Portrayals of violent sex - which I personally find repulsive - appeal to a fairly small number, usually those who are unable to assert themselves in real life and are able to lose themselves briefly in the fantasies portrayed.

It has been said many times, but it really does bear repeating, that the hardest thing of all is to define pornography. If we are saying that it is images or film which is specifically designed to arouse people then it could be argued that an awful lot of adverts etc would need to be banned.

Finally, the phrase 'sex and violence' is used too freely, as if the two were unavoidably connected - they are not, at least to most people. Violent images need to be dealt with as a separate issue IMO.

I can see nothing inherently wrong in a man looking at a woman in "short skirts, high heels, lipstick and nice bras etc." and finding her sexually desirable. All of those are - according to anthropologists - specifically designed for that purpose!

The ambiguous British attitude towards sex - we want it but we're not allowed to admit it - has probably caused more problems than any amount of pornographic imagery ever will.

[matty]

besides, who's really being exploited? the woman, being paid a hella lotta cash, or the man watching it, PAYING a hella lotta cash to watch it?

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In my opinion it is the woman being paid who is degraded. In addition other women have to endure the hostile environment created by pornography.

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I don't quite understand what you mean about women being "degraded" by pornography, I beleive women are turned on just as much as men when it comes to porn.

 

I with Lonan on his post regarding "sex & violence"

 

I absolutely dont think all men are what you say (nice turn of phrase incidentally!)

You are also correct in that women, me included, sometimes wear clothes knowing or hoping they will look attractive to men. I have short skirts in my wardrobe, I love my high heels and lipstick and I try to make the best of my figure with nice bras etc.

 

- Don't quite understand you not wanting to be looked at or in your own words "degraded", yet are prepared to wear the above clothing to gain the attention of the opposite sex??

 

Many women will wear clothing/make-up to gain the "attention" of men, and will use this to their own advantage - is this degrading women, or degrading men?

 

Sure enough in many garages / workshops and "men's workplaces" you'll find the odd "girly calendar", but I've also seen calendars of semi naked men in offices - is there a distinction between the two, to say it's ok for women to have calendars/posters of men, but it's not ok for men to have "girly calendars"?

[Addie]

I can't quite believe that everyone taking part in films featuring rape and other sexually violent acts is willing. I can also understand that most people watching this type of thing would hope that they were willing as this erases the need to question the circumstances.

 

theintelligentthug said

besides, who's really being exploited? the woman, being paid a hella lotta cash …

Are you absolutely 100 percent certain about that?

Link

 

matty said

Many women will wear clothing/make-up to gain the "attention" of men, and will use this to their own advantage - is this degrading women, or degrading men?

A woman trotting around wearing make-up and high heels is far away from the subject of this thread. So, sorry, but many women probably like to look good for their own feeling of wellbeing and not just to 'attract' some male or other. Perhaps women are on men's minds to a far greater extent than men occupy the minds of women?

[Slim]

I would take a lot of convincing that people who object to pornography per se are maladjusted.

Pornographic pictures, films and stories , involving females, are terribly demeaning to women ..and without exception all embody violence to the self respect of the women involved.... and create a hostile environment for other women to live in.

I, for one, find it hard to understand the UK Government reasoning on this one. Surely all pornography should be banned.

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That's 100% bollocks. Men are attracted to women, women are attracted to men. Porn doesn't change this. You seem to find this very natural thing opressive and offencive?

 

I never get this demonising of porn when there's far worse things around like racial hatred, extremely violent films that are far more likey to influence behavour. Most porn is just people pleasuring each other, what's so bad about that?

[ans]

I can't quite believe that everyone taking part in films featuring rape and other sexually violent acts is willing.

 

If they weren't, then no distributor would touch them. Of course there are always illegal channels, but this proposed legislation doesn't matter to them anyway.

 

Slim is far more an expert on porn than I am, but I think he'd back me up when I say that it would be extremely difficult for you to find genuine rape movies featuring unwilling participants without a determined and concerted effort. And even then you'd struggle.

 

No offence, but I suspect you'd be one of the least knowledgable on the subject in this thread (which is no bad thing I guess) and that most of your opinion is formed from media articles and exposé documentaries that bear little resemblance to the truth.

[When Skies Are Grey]

Slim is far more an expert on porn than I am, but I think he'd back me up

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Hmmmmm.....paging Freud to the thread!!

[Slim]

Slim is far more an expert on porn than I am, but I think he'd back me up when I say that it would be extremely difficult for you to find genuine rape movies featuring unwilling participants without a determined and concerted effort. And even then you'd struggle.

 

I have nothing like the volume of goat porn you boast.

 

I agree though, I think there's too many people here applying their own values to every other person on the planet. There's some very successful, intelligent, high profile porn stars now retired who can and have looked back on their carrers with no regrets. They earned a lot of money, they claim to have enjoyed themselves and they gave a lot of people a lot of pleasure. The only people I see exploited by porn in the main is men who like to consume it.

 

No offence, but I suspect you'd be one of the least knowledgable on the subject in this thread (which is no bad thing I guess) and that most of your opinion is formed from media articles and exposé documentaries that bear little resemblance to the truth.

 

I imagine there is exploitation, there's desperate people doing things they dont want to do for money, there's people being persuaded to go further than they would, and all that kind of thing. But a lot of this in my view is a consequence of pron still being fairly underground, especially in the UK. In the usa its much more mainstream, open and more professional in the main.

 

I feel pretty much the same way about prostitution, it works very well for a lot of girls when it's not criminalised. There's plenty of british girls go work for a month a year in 'dam for example where its safe and they're looked after and can earn a few grand a day. You criminalise it, you get people working outside the law and you get problems.

 

Watch the excellent series 'the brothel' on how well legalised prostitution can work. It's not an offensive series, there's no nudity or sex in it. It's an unbiased presentation of daily life in a knocking shop, and there's very little exploitation going on of anyone but the punters.

[sarahc]

Nobody yet has told me why pictures of rapes (real or staged) is okay.

[Addie]

Slim is far more an expert on porn than I am

Good grief! I'll let that one alone I think.

 

No offence, but I suspect you'd be one of the least knowledgable on the subject in this thread (which is no bad thing I guess) and that most of your opinion is formed from media articles and exposé documentaries that bear little resemblance to the truth.

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Unless you were actually involved in their making, I'm not sure how one could know 'the truth'.

 

But then, if you've changed the forum rules so we all have to know what we're talking about, it's gonna get pretty quiet in here! ;-)

 

Slim, I don't have a problem with legalised and properly run brothels etc as long as they're not on my doorstep. I'm less prissy than Nimby.

[When Skies Are Grey]

Pornogrpahy = Sexually explicit pictures, writing, or other material whose primary purpose is to cause sexual arousal

 

Cue Bill Hicks....

[Slim]

Nobody yet has told me why pictures of rapes (real or staged) is okay.

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Let me ask you a question as a reply, are staged pictures or movies of people being killed okay?

[puddy]

Pornography is fast becoming the last refuge for men as women take over the world.

 

This thread does nothing but to remind us of that.

[Ean]

Nobody yet has told me why pictures of rapes (real or staged) is okay.

 

Because pictures of horribly violent murders are okay, because of every other crime that can be seen in the latest hollywood blockbuster etc. If some people want to watch the films about rape for entertainment then i don't really have a leg to stand on, i watch films like Saw for entertainment which feature horribly grotesque murders etc.

 

This outcry has happened because real life events have mirrored fantasy events available through various media. Look at the Sun and it's campaign with Childs Play 3, the police said something along the lines of "if you must link a film to this murder then it could just as easily be the railway children" Happens every time the (usually written) media percieve a reason for there to be public outcry. From video games to the internet to dvd's to music every single one ican be a source that depicts violent acts, are we to ban them all? No, because millions of people are entertained by them. Just because a few people cannot percieve the fantasy involved in these films and games does not mean the whole thing should be banned.

 

If a kid see's a fight breakout at a football match and then goes on to start fights in his school matches do the papers try to ban football? No, because that's not a way to increase your reader numbers.

[sarahc]

Nobody yet has told me why pictures of rapes (real or staged) is okay.

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Let me ask you a question as a reply, are staged pictures or movies of people being killed okay?

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I think that if they are part of a story being told then yes. If the whole point of them is so that someone will get off on them, then no. The email I was sent was definitely in the latter category.

[Slim]

I think that if they are part of a story being told then yes.  If the whole point of them is so that someone will get off on them, then no.  The email I was sent was definitely in the latter category.

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So something shouldn't be allowed because someone might enjoy it? Can you please explain that some more?

 

 

The problem you seem to be having is separating fantasy from reality. For some reason this gets blurred when pornography is involved, yet it's fine when someones getting killed in a movie. I just don't get that.

 

If someone wants to watch porn where someone re-enacts a rape and enjoys that, then so what? It's a fantasy, it's not real. That person wont go out and rape someone. It's no different from someone enjoying watching Natural Born Killers, they wont go out and shoot people.

 

Reading a book, going to a play, all these things can contain events that you do not recreate simply because you've been exposed to them.

 

Adults can separate fantasy from reality. For some reason some people just see the red mist when it's porn and the thinking gets disjointed. You also get old fashioned and sexist muck like the last post from Puddy. I don't get it, the majority of porn is just people being nice to each other, pretty much every other western country has accepted and trivialised it, we're still dark ages for some reason. It's quite bizzare.