Diesel v Petrol pump prices

[AcousticallyChallenged]

9 hours ago, woolley said:

Indeed. But even providing a different spec to the UK for such a small market would indicate increased cost too, even if the product was slightly "less processed". 'Tis a mystery.

It could be as simple as not turning on the tap for ethanol to be added into the mix when it’s loaded into the tankers towards us.

[John Wright]

11 hours ago, woolley said:

Indeed. But even providing a different spec to the UK for such a small market would indicate increased cost too, even if the product was slightly "less processed". 'Tis a mystery.

 

1 hour ago, AcousticallyChallenged said:

It could be as simple as not turning on the tap for ethanol to be added into the mix when it’s loaded into the tankers towards us.

It’s as simple as that.

And bio diesel isn’t 100% bio unless the engine has been specially adapted. It’s generally less than 10% mixed in with petrodiesel and is marked on the pumps with B, rather than E, numbers. In UK normally B5 or B10.

The E or B is mixed into the basic refined product just before being sent out for delivery. So there’s no extra cost to shipping non E or D mixed product to IoM.

 

[woolley]

2 hours ago, John Wright said:

 

It’s as simple as that.

And bio diesel isn’t 100% bio unless the engine has been specially adapted. It’s generally less than 10% mixed in with petrodiesel and is marked on the pumps with B, rather than E, numbers. In UK normally B5 or B10.

The E or B is mixed into the basic refined product just before being sent out for delivery. So there’s no extra cost to shipping non E or D mixed product to IoM.

 

If true, this doesn't address why diesel should be 10% cheaper here?

[John Wright]

4 minutes ago, woolley said:

If true, this doesn't address why diesel should be 10% cheaper here?

Or why the price difference across the UK can be 15%, or more, from cheapest to most expensive.

Its market, as you well know.

Purchasing ahead, volume, which refinery or depot, shipping costs, delivery costs, site rentals and values, how much the retailer is making ( often supermarkets offer as a no loss “loss leader” at UK sites ).

It’s why Motorway fuel is very expensive and was always more expensive than here. It’s why small retail chains in UK offering under their own brand, in out of the way places, can offer cheaper.

Suspect we are benefiting from judicious purchasing, cheaper shipping, and a glut of product. I’m not sure where our diesel is picked up. But because it’s brought in by boat, rather than road tanker, wholesale purchase can be more flexible, and take advantage.

[woolley]

12 minutes ago, John Wright said:

Or why the price difference across the UK can be 15%, or more, from cheapest to most expensive.

Its market, as you well know.

Purchasing ahead, volume, which refinery or depot, shipping costs, delivery costs, site rentals and values, how much the retailer is making ( often supermarkets offer as a no loss “loss leader” at UK sites ).

It’s why Motorway fuel is very expensive and was always more expensive than here. It’s why small retail chains in UK offering under their own brand, in out of the way places, can offer cheaper.

Suspect we are benefiting from judicious purchasing, cheaper shipping, and a glut of product. I’m not sure where our diesel is picked up. But because it’s brought in by boat, rather than road tanker, wholesale purchase can be more flexible, and take advantage.

Stanlow and Milford Haven. Again, there are no market reasons why we are suddenly 10% cheaper when historically we've been between 5p and 8p dearer across the board. If anything, the opposite still applies. Not complaining, obviously. It makes a refreshing change.

 

ETA: Probably all Stanlow now. I knew the chap who started bringing it from Milford Haven in the 90s for Total but I see it's shut down now.

Edited May 28, 2023 by woolley

[Manxman1234]

17 hours ago, woolley said:

 

E10 is petrol. We're talking about diesel.

Do they really process different fuels through the UK system specifically for the Isle of Man? That seems highly unlikely. We usually just get what we're given.

 

18 hours ago, Non-Believer said:

And it's very welcome, one wonders how the differential is arising though?

For years we were told that the then higher price of fuel on the Island was at least partly due to the lower volumes being sold here, economics of scale etc. So have we suddenly started buying and using more fuel than UK outlets and consumers or is there another reason?

Profiteering by Uk forecourts or trying to off set list volume as people get forced to

move to EV 

[Banker]

19 hours ago, Non-Believer said:

And it's very welcome, one wonders how the differential is arising though?

For years we were told that the then higher price of fuel on the Island was at least partly due to the lower volumes being sold here, economics of scale etc. So have we suddenly started buying and using more fuel than UK outlets and consumers or is there another reason?

Yes the usual Facebook whiners plus the usual people on here haven’t been posting about how they’re being ripped off over TT by rampant profiteering & it’s all the governments or DBCS fault 

[Beelzebub3]

£1.37/41 a litre here for diesel £1.39/41 for unleaded petrol in N Ireland.

[Cambon]

On 5/28/2023 at 1:45 PM, woolley said:

If true, this doesn't address why diesel should be 10% cheaper here?

I do know that the 10% ethanol costs around three times as much as the petrol it is replacing, and has quite a negative impact on fuel economy.
Also, We are actually being overcharged for petrol at the moment.

[Manxman1234]

5 hours ago, Cambon said:

I do know that the 10% ethanol costs around three times as much as the petrol it is replacing, and has quite a negative impact on fuel economy.
Also, We are actually being overcharged for petrol at the moment.

What should we be paying? Have you inside information on stock levels and their cost prices of local fuel companies? 

[Cambon]

1 hour ago, Manxman1234 said:

What should we be paying? Have you inside information on stock levels and their cost prices of local fuel companies? 

No. i simply follow the markets, and I am generally correct. Diesel has reduced considerably. Petrol should do the same but not quite to the same extent. Unleaded is at 147, just come down 1P. Calculation at todays price is 1.43. However, that is for July delivery. Price has recently gone up by circa 30cents per us gallon and exchange rate had weakened by 1.5 cents. This would give current delivery price of  around 1.38.

[Manxman1234]

7 hours ago, Cambon said:

No. i simply follow the markets, and I am generally correct. Diesel has reduced considerably. Petrol should do the same but not quite to the same extent. Unleaded is at 147, just come down 1P. Calculation at todays price is 1.43. However, that is for July delivery. Price has recently gone up by circa 30cents per us gallon and exchange rate had weakened by 1.5 cents. This would give current delivery price of  around 1.38.

I’m guessing If delivery price 138 , you presuming they run as a charity and have no over heads so they should give it away at cost price? 
are you remembering there is 2 parts to the chain.

Manx P will need to take margin to cover all their over heads and a small return. The retailers such as spar then have their over heads and a return to make from it 

 

Retailers will take around 5p per litre and I would be amazed if that even covered over heads these days 

Edited May 31, 2023 by Manxman1234

[Ringy Rose]

11 hours ago, Cambon said:

This would give current delivery price of  around 1.38

If MP and EVF are paying shipping costs and overheads out of that 11p/litre then I’d say you’ve just proven that nobody is being ripped off.

Given how hard EVF are pushing things like Snappy Shopper and that beerkeg machine thingy, I’d say they make naff all on the petrol.

[Cambon]

5 hours ago, Manxman1234 said:

I’m guessing If delivery price 138 , you presuming they run as a charity and have no over heads so they should give it away at cost price? 
are you remembering there is 2 parts to the chain.

Manx P will need to take margin to cover all their over heads and a small return. The retailers such as spar then have their over heads and a return to make from it 

 

Retailers will take around 5p per litre and I would be amazed if that even covered over heads these days 

Includes 12P including vat for handling, profit, etc. 

[Cambon]

1 hour ago, Ringy Rose said:

If MP and EVF are paying shipping costs and overheads out of that 11p/litre then I’d say you’ve just proven that nobody is being ripped off.

Given how hard EVF are pushing things like Snappy Shopper and that beerkeg machine thingy, I’d say they make naff all on the petrol.

See above. Before ethanol was added, we were told that we were paying 2P extra per litre over UK due to handling. Due to E10, we should be paying at least 8P less