Follow the Manxman from South Korea

[Happier diner]

1 hour ago, John Wright said:

You’re wrong. 

Manannan will be sailing so swell/wave height can’t be all that much ( less than 3 metres )

Steam Packet are specifically saying they’ve adopted a 24 mph wind limit in Heysham Harbour ( the harbour isn’t likely to be affected by “swell” or rough waves

Any Harbour is definitely affected by swell. The wall reduces the waves significantly but there can still swell waves in a harbour (see bottom of page 3 of the attachment). No sea wall is 100% effective. The turn in Heysham was tight with the Ben and now even tighter. Even a small penetration of swell will make that harder. Add to that its got to get into the harbour in the first place

I just reckon they want to practice a bit more and that's probably why this limit is set. The operation of the Mannanan is well established. It 38m shorter. That is significant.

https://coastadapt.com.au/sites/default/files/factsheets/T3I4_Coastal_waves.pdf

I still don't think its the action of the wind directly on the side of the ship.

 

[John Wright]

7 minutes ago, 2bees said:

Did I dream that there is a problem with the emergency escapes?

Yes

[Capt_Mainwaring]

3 minutes ago, Happier diner said:

Any Harbour is definitely affected by swell. The wall reduces the waves significantly but there can still swell waves in a harbour (see bottom of page 3 of the attachment). No sea wall is 100% effective. The turn in Heysham was tight with the Ben and now even tighter. Even a small penetration of swell will make that harder. Add to that its got to get into the harbour in the first place

I just reckon they want to practice a bit more and that's probably why this limit is set. The operation of the Mannanan is well established. It 38m shorter. That is significant.

https://coastadapt.com.au/sites/default/files/factsheets/T3I4_Coastal_waves.pdf

I still don't think its the action of the wind directly on the side of the ship.

 

The wind is easterly, it is 100% not swell in Heysham Harbour that is the issue. It's manoeuvring a high sided vessel in strong wind.

[Happier diner]

Just now, Capt_Mainwaring said:

The wind is easterly, it is 100% not swell in Heysham Harbour that is the issue. It's manoeuvring a high sided vessel in strong wind.

A 24,000 Tonnes ship gets blown in the wind?

Tomorrow the wind is SSW

[John Wright]

2 minutes ago, Happier diner said:

Any Harbour is definitely affected by swell. The wall reduces the waves significantly but there can still swell waves in a harbour (see bottom of page 3 of the attachment). No sea wall is 100% effective. The turn in Heysham was tight with the Ben and now even tighter. Even a small penetration of swell will make that harder. Add to that its got to get into the harbour in the first place

I just reckon they want to practice a bit more and that's probably why this limit is set. The operation of the Mannanan is well established. It 38m shorter. That is significant.

https://coastadapt.com.au/sites/default/files/factsheets/T3I4_Coastal_waves.pdf

I still don't think its the action of the wind directly on the side of the ship.

 

Yes, there’ll be a bit of swell, amount will depend on wind direction. But the effect of swell in harbour will be minimal compared to the effect of wind forces on a slab side.

Not sure what Mannanan has to do with this as the river berth in the Mersey isn’t really affected by swell.

They’ve had six weeks in which to practice.

I’ve seen 20 Steam Packet passenger boats arrive and sailed on them all early on in their careers. Apart from one I’ll fated one there’s never been anything like this

[John Wright]

9 minutes ago, Happier diner said:

A 24,000 Tonnes ship gets blown in the wind?

Tomorrow the wind is SSW

It’s the resistance to wind when manoeuvring.

You do understand how a kite works?

[Capt_Mainwaring]

4 minutes ago, Happier diner said:

A 24,000 Tonnes ship gets blown in the wind?

Tomorrow the wind is SSW

Again, no issue in Heysham Harbour in SSW with swell, simply wind on the side of the vessel.

Been on the Ben several times when tugs have been in attendance at Douglas to aid berthing in strong winds. No doubt similar may be required for Manxman. Nothing to do with swell.

[Capt_Mainwaring]

7 minutes ago, John Wright said:

Yes, there’ll be a bit of swell, amount will depend on wind direction. But the effect of swell in harbour will be minimal compared to the effect of wind forces on a slab side.

Not sure what Mannanan has to do with this as the river berth in the Mersey isn’t really affected by swell.

They’ve had six weeks in which to practice.

I’ve seen 20 Steam Packet passenger boats arrive and sailed on them all early on in their careers. Apart from one I’ll fated one there’s never been anything like this

Didn't King Orry V break her mooring ropes in Heysham Harbour in strong winds?

The Ben was also blown onto the harbourside and smashed the gangway back in 2010/11ish?

[Jarndyce]

18 minutes ago, John Wright said:

26 minutes ago, 2bees said:

Did I dream that there is a problem with the emergency escapes?

Yes

Keep a notebook and pencil by the bed, jot your dreams down when you awake - then you won’t need to ask John what you dreamt…

[Capt_Mainwaring]

17 minutes ago, Happier diner said:

A 24,000 Tonnes ship gets blown in the wind?

Tomorrow the wind is SSW

https://shipinspection.eu/berthing-in-wind/

Bit of reading for you.

[Capt_Mainwaring]

9 minutes ago, Capt_Mainwaring said:

Didn't King Orry V break her mooring ropes in Heysham Harbour in strong winds?

@John Wright https://www.facebook.com/IsleofManSteamPacketNostalgia/videos/3040846402808652/?mibextid=rS40aB7S9Ucbxw6v

Might have been related... sure I remember something.

[daisy]

31 minutes ago, 2bees said:

Did I dream that there is a problem with the emergency escapes?

There was def something mentioned that the emergency chute could not be deployed in rough seas (cant remember what the actual figs were though!).  

[The Phantom]

There will be some swell today.  Big for the summer, but not much compared to the winter.  The wind will be Easterly over in Heysham, but the storm is centred farther south and will generate a southerly swell which will travel up the Irish sea (maybe 3 / 4m open sea max).  Waves will also bend and refract into bays or harbours.  Although from my recollection Heysham should be relatively sheltered. 

Speaking as someone who has spent some time actually driving boats (speedboats/RIBs/yachts) I think this is just them easing into getting used to the berthing in Heysham.  It's a big expensive boat and Heysham is pretty sketchy.  It's going to be blowing a hoolie later and I'm sure they want to get a decent bit of experience in lower winds first.  They've got the ability to run an alternative, so why risk it?  Hopefully. 

[Manxman2000]

28 minutes ago, John Wright said:

Not sure what Mannanan has to do with this as the river berth in the Mersey isn’t really affected by swell.

Go and tell one of the Mersey Pilots that.  the river can be very badly affected by swell,  I have been on the 74m seacat with the cat going one way and the pontoon going the other.  and don't forget the Superseacat needed the help of a tug on many occasions.  Many years ago I was on the mersey ferry to Woodside when the ferry had to stand off for about 10 mins due to the swell. The swell will affect the new terminal  and to add to that the silt building up to the two old dock gates, one that will have the link span.  big problems ahead in Liverpool and Heysham. If the windage in Heysham is a problem why build a boat with such a big sail area. 

[Ringy Rose]

6 minutes ago, The Phantom said:

Speaking as someone who has spent some time actually driving boats (speedboats/RIBs/yachts) I think this is just them easing into getting used to the berthing in Heysham. 

This.

The Manxman is no bigger or higher than the Seatruck ferries that also use Heysham. It’s a brand new boat, why risk using it when the Ben is there?