Joney and the Bishop

[Moghrey Mie]

9 hours ago, Stu Peters said:

Given my right of centre upbringing I agree with Joney on a number of issues, this included. We’ll probably be outvoted again but our numbers grow each administration.  Bish is a lovely guy and often makes good points, but that isn’t the point.

Secular society is the way to go.

[GreyWolf]

I agree with Joney, also we need less pomp privilege and old fashioned ceremony and the above post from Moghrey Mie hits the spot.

[forestboy]

45 minutes ago, GreyWolf said:

I agree with Joney, also we need less pomp privilege and old fashioned ceremony and the above post from Moghrey Mie hits the spot.

And less of the Honorable 

[2112]

I think Joney is getting rather boring. The island has too many issues to worry about at present and here we are concerned with trivial matters which don’t really cause harm. Elected MLCs yes, Bishop role like the COE in the HOL but no voting rights. 

[Passing Time]

10 hours ago, HiVibes said:

He should just stand for election, it's a very low bar.

You'll waltz in then...

[doc.fixit]

47 minutes ago, 2112 said:

I think Joney is getting rather boring. The island has too many issues to worry about at present and here we are concerned with trivial matters which don’t really cause harm. Elected MLCs yes, Bishop role like the COE in the HOL but no voting rights. 

Hmm. Some of those trivial matters are possibly what are causing the powers to not see the wood for the trees. By having the pomp ceremony and oter things mentioned they are used as smoke screens for what is actually going on ? Maybe.

[Shake me up Judy]

Perhaps though, while we're voting against the bishop, some of our Tynwald members could actually get off their ass and make their own democratic contribution.

[Moghrey Mie]

7 hours ago, GreyWolf said:

I agree with Joney, also we need less pomp privilege and old fashioned ceremony and the above post from Moghrey Mie hits the spot.

https://www.secularism.org.uk/opinion/2023/05/house-of-lords-makes-politicians-out-of-prelates

[watchover]

Nah. On balance the bishop is probably one of the most sensible members, and structurally the least in hock to special interests (their very status as outsiders ensures this; the basis of their employment is neither private finance nor public bureaucracy). On the contrary, I agree with Joney on most matters, but think this is barking up the wrong bush. The bishop is probably more amenable to making the island a fairer place (see the CoE's reaction to austerity, refugee maltreatment, culture wars etc in England).

[Max Power]

26 minutes ago, watchover said:

Nah. On balance the bishop is probably one of the most sensible members, and structurally the least in hock to special interests (their very status as outsiders ensures this; the basis of their employment is neither private finance nor public bureaucracy). On the contrary, I agree with Joney on most matters, but think this is barking up the wrong bush. The bishop is probably more amenable to making the island a fairer place (see the CoE's reaction to austerity, refugee maltreatment, culture wars etc in England).

I’m not in favour of religious meddling in politics but you have a point there. 
In fact the Bishop probably has more of a left leaning than a right wing bent?

Apart from all that, he’s probably better educated than most in government!

[HeliX]

12 hours ago, watchover said:

(see the CoE's reaction to austerity, refugee maltreatment, culture wars etc in England).

All for the low-low cost of buggering some kids.

[Thomas Dalby]

12 hours ago, Max Power said:

I’m not in favour of religious meddling in politics but you have a point there. 
In fact the Bishop probably has more of a left leaning than a right wing bent?

Apart from all that, he’s probably better educated than most in government!

I can see the arguments for supporting or opposing the Bishop being there and having a vote as a matter of principle, but deciding the issue based on the political views of the holder of the post at any given time is so muddle-headed

[hissingsid]

It is the chosen Bishop’s last gig before retiring a bit like god’s waiting room.   The Bishop may be the most socially aware and well meaning human in Tynwald but to have a vote on a controversial and emotive bill as the Dignity in Dying one is totally wrong he just not an elected member of the house.    Before someone points out LegCo are not elected by the public, agreed, but they are appointed by people whom the public have elected and have faith in ,or did have when they voted for them, so not the same thing.   

[The Phantom]

17 hours ago, watchover said:

Nah. On balance the bishop is probably one of the most sensible members, and structurally the least in hock to special interests (their very status as outsiders ensures this; the basis of their employment is neither private finance nor public bureaucracy). 

Interesting angle which I'd probably agree with.  Almost view him like a Non-Executive Director or moderator.  Just don't give him a vote.

Current Lt Gov would be good for this too. 

[offshoremanxman]

On 5/21/2023 at 11:38 AM, 2112 said:

I think Joney is getting rather boring. The island has too many issues to worry about at present and here we are concerned with trivial matters which don’t really cause harm. Elected MLCs yes, Bishop role like the COE in the HOL but no voting rights. 

Yes but she’s right on this point. But Manx Labour is a one trick pony. The trick having been first performed in 1978 by a man in a donkey jacket and soiled trousers. They just all seem so grateful to be given a seat at the table that they won’t be rocking any boats.