Roger Mexico Posted June 22, 2023 Share Posted June 22, 2023 2 hours ago, Kopek said: 4 hours ago, Andy Onchan said: The Bishops stipend is paid from York ( I think). .... but he is also paid as a member of Legco and that may be all or part of wage? I'm sure I have heard in the past that the money is part of the reason the church retain the Diocese and have used it as a 'threat' to removing the bish? The Bishop gets no salary from the government as part of his seat on LegCo. He does seem to get a sum for 'expenses' which is currently around £8,000. He doesn't get a pension from Tynwald either, like his salary that comes from the Church of England. As for the threat that removing the Bishop from LegCo will mean that the post of the Bishop of Sodor and Man is abolished, I've heard this a lot over the years, but I'm not convinced it's a valid argument. I suspect the real reason is more that it would require a lot of legal work to get rid of the post and the co-operation of Tynwald - which wouldn't be forthcoming. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malik Posted June 22, 2023 Share Posted June 22, 2023 3 hours ago, woolley said: Define soon? The seals will begin being opened within 3.5 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Onchan Posted June 22, 2023 Share Posted June 22, 2023 2 hours ago, La_Dolce_Vita said: They haven't done so at every parliamentary debate. Aren't they understood to be guests to express a view on something that is fundamentally related to a motion? That, as you know, is different from a permanent position to debate and vote on everything. The people you mention are/were members of the House of Lords not guests but debated along with all the others in that House. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Helmut Fromage Posted June 22, 2023 Share Posted June 22, 2023 1 hour ago, Malik said: The seals will begin being opened within 3.5 years. Seals - Clappy sea creatures who balance balls on their nose ? What other kind of seals ? Stop talking in riddles and say it in words that make sense. For the benefit of the Forum please clarify if you are one of Stansfields lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malik Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 11 hours ago, Mr Helmut Fromage said: What other kind of seals ? Stop talking in riddles and say it in words that make sense. For the benefit of the Forum please clarify if you are one of Stansfields lot. The seals found in Revelation. No, I’m not a member of Living Hope Church. For information, religion and Christianity is my favourite subject but I’m not obsessive and won’t be evangelical on here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moghrey Mie Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 19 hours ago, Andy Onchan said: The people you mention are/were members of the House of Lords not guests but debated along with all the others in that House. https://www.secularism.org.uk/news/2023/06/mps-to-debate-the-role-of-bishops-in-house-of-lords This may produce a higher quality of debate than we had in Tynwald. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Two-lane Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 1 hour ago, Moghrey Mie said: https://www.secularism.org.uk/news/2023/06/mps-to-debate-the-role-of-bishops-in-house-of-lords "Iran is the only other country which has religious clerics in its legislature." Hmmm..... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malik Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 2 hours ago, Moghrey Mie said: https://www.secularism.org.uk/news/2023/06/mps-to-debate-the-role-of-bishops-in-house-of-lords This may produce a higher quality of debate than we had in Tynwald. If there were none, or only a minority of members practicing true faith in any government, legislation would be founded on immorality, bribery, lying, deceit, hatred, self-serving and perversion, exactly what it seen in British politics and why “In March the Commission on Political Power said the bishops are an "anomalous" presence in the House of Lords”. Nothing motivates a secular member of government to be righteous and upstanding in modern politics. Those I’ve observed aren’t bothered about integrity, being judged or legacy and only care about accountability if they can get voted back in. A bishop elder would have had some role/influence in Tynwald from the start judging by the keeills. Most young Manx don’t seem to care about this heritage, mainly visiting churches in the parish walk. Persecuted religious immigrants might like it though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
La_Dolce_Vita Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 Judging by the keeills? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 10 hours ago, Malik said: The seals found in Revelation. No, I’m not a member of Living Hope Church. For information, religion and Christianity is my favourite subject but I’m not obsessive and won’t be evangelical on here. You have my sympathy. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malik Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 16 minutes ago, woolley said: You have my sympathy. You’re a member? Oh, I am surprised. Yes they do have happy smiling faces in the photos I’ve seen. But I do as well. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Voice of Reason Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 On 6/22/2023 at 7:48 PM, Kopek said: We'd be better off with Ken Livingston in Legco???????? Personal opinion but I’d agree with that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 11 minutes ago, Malik said: You’re a member? Oh, I am surprised. Yes they do have happy smiling faces in the photos I’ve seen. But I do as well. Me too. All the more smiley through not being encumbered by nonsense like religion in any of its forms. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malik Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 16 minutes ago, woolley said: Me too. All the more smiley through not being encumbered by nonsense like religion in any of its forms. I see. I didn’t know what you meant. Yes, it does seem there’s know freedom of speech on here and people cannot evangelise, not that I ever intended to in the first place. I only mentioned that because I was done for ‘spamming’ having read the rules upon joining. That’s fair enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted June 23, 2023 Share Posted June 23, 2023 16 minutes ago, Malik said: I see. I didn’t know what you meant. Yes, it does seem there’s know freedom of speech on here and people cannot evangelise, not that I ever intended to in the first place. I only mentioned that because I was done for ‘spamming’ having read the rules upon joining. That’s fair enough. Well there is freedom of speech, but the problem is when some people expound their unlikely beliefs about the nature of existence and creation as though they were fact, often coupled with a zeal that brooks no denial or even doubt. I appreciate you are not doing that, but it has been known in the past. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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