The emotional and financial cost of doing business on the Isle of Man

[jackwhite]

40 minutes ago, offshoremanxman said:

Just seen your sponsored Facebook Ad. It must be getting pressing now. 

?

[Ringy Rose]

17 hours ago, The Phantom said:

Yeah but there needs to be a really good reason to do significant stuff here on a small island, rather than in the US or Middle East, where there are already obvious and significant markets and infrastructure. 

There’s a AML/CFT audit by the global regulator coming up in the next 2-3 years. If the FSA isn’t regulating in the exact same way as in bigger jurisdictions then the island may well be grey-listed. And if you think red tape is bad now, look what happened in Malta when they got grey-listed.

[Ringy Rose]

14 hours ago, Blade Runner said:

Best thing I did and I have not looked back, small business success is welcomed here, not shot down by Crabs.

Wait until you have to deal with HMRC, and get back to us about how everything is amazing on the adjacent island.

[The Phantom]

12 hours ago, Kopek said:

\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\wdhy do we need financial regulations? Is it possibly because 'We' will try to take the piss without them???

Unfortunately this is correct.  

32 minutes ago, Ringy Rose said:

There’s a AML/CFT audit by the global regulator coming up in the next 2-3 years. If the FSA isn’t regulating in the exact same way as in bigger jurisdictions then the island may well be grey-listed. And if you think red tape is bad now, look what happened in Malta when they got grey-listed.

Malta demonstrates how pointless a lot of the regulation is, the place is completely corrupt and full of cartel & mafia. 

The thing is the FSA regulates way in excess of the UK/US.  Obviously we're held to a higher standard due to our offshore status, but some of the stuff I've seen that you can do in the UK and especially the US in terms of lack of regs is mind blowing compared to here. 

I often joke with clients when they are questioning our requirements versus those they are used to in the non-offshore world, that if you want to launder money, you do it in plain sight in London or New York. 

[Ringy Rose]

2 minutes ago, The Phantom said:

I often joke with clients when they are questioning our requirements versus those they are used to in the non-offshore world, that if you want to launder money, you do it in plain sight in London or New York.

There’s an awful lot of truth in that. Do it in plain sight in a relatively straightforward structure in a big jurisdiction and chances are it’ll go through without anyone batting an eyelid. 

But as an offshore jurisdiction we do get held to different standards, and of course any decision from a global regulator is inevitably political. Jersey and Guernsey experience the same issues.

[The Phantom]

Echoed by the chamber of commerce this morning. 

Results from its Q2 2023 Quarterly Economic Survey (QES) show 93% of respondents expressed a vote of no confidence in Government when asked if they believed the economic strategy would be completed as promised.

In the same poll, which included responses from 64 respondents, 83% said red tape was preventing them from investing and hindering growth.

‘With 93% of respondents believing the economic strategy will not achieve the goals for growth that Government has set out, the message from the business community is loud and clear. They want to see more clarity on actions, deliverables and timelines,’ said chamber president Kristan McDonald.

‘That’s why the chamber is calling for urgent action and stronger leadership to help restore confidence, and support economic growth.

‘We appreciate that there are many demands on ministers and officials right now, but the chamber feels strongly that it is in Government’s and the island’s best interests to address the concerns of businesses,’ he added.

[jackwhite]

57 minutes ago, The Phantom said:

Echoed by the chamber of commerce this morning. 

Results from its Q2 2023 Quarterly Economic Survey (QES) show 93% of respondents expressed a vote of no confidence in Government when asked if they believed the economic strategy would be completed as promised.

In the same poll, which included responses from 64 respondents, 83% said red tape was preventing them from investing and hindering growth.

‘With 93% of respondents believing the economic strategy will not achieve the goals for growth that Government has set out, the message from the business community is loud and clear. They want to see more clarity on actions, deliverables and timelines,’ said chamber president Kristan McDonald.

‘That’s why the chamber is calling for urgent action and stronger leadership to help restore confidence, and support economic growth.

‘We appreciate that there are many demands on ministers and officials right now, but the chamber feels strongly that it is in Government’s and the island’s best interests to address the concerns of businesses,’ he added.

Chamber are great for saying these things, not so great at getting things done.

No confidence in the people they have in place.

[The Phantom]

4 minutes ago, jackwhite said:

Chamber are great for saying these things, not so great at getting things done.

No confidence in the people they have in place.

I think the issue really is that Govt doesn't listen to what they are saying. 

[jackwhite]

4 minutes ago, The Phantom said:

I think the issue really is that Govt doesn't listen to what they are saying. 

Possibly, but honestly, would you? 

As much as they are nice people, do you see them as business leaders, let alone one leading the interests of a whole host of businesses on the Isle of Man?

I don't personally.

I think there are a few on the board who are very capable but all have their own significant business interests.

[The Phantom]

2 minutes ago, jackwhite said:

Possibly, but honestly, would you? 

As much as they are nice people, do you see them as business leaders, let alone one leading the interests of a whole host of businesses on the Isle of Man?

I don't personally.

I think there are a few on the board who are very capable but all have their own significant business interests.

Kristan is pretty reasonable guy and solid businessman.  I don't know too much about the rest of the 'leaders' of it.  The Chamber however is the only real collection of businesses across all sectors that does anything at all to try and comment as one business voice upon Govt policy. 

[jackwhite]

3 minutes ago, The Phantom said:

Kristan is pretty reasonable guy and solid businessman.  I don't know too much about the rest of the 'leaders' of it.  The Chamber however is the only real collection of businesses across all sectors that does anything at all to try and comment as one business voice upon Govt policy. 

I attend quite a few of the events and don't have any confidence in the people on the ground. 

As I said, they have some good people on the board but that doesn't necessarily mean much.

[Derek Flint]

21 hours ago, Blade Runner said:

This is why I just gave up and moved to the mainland.

You cant win with the "Blob"

Best thing I did and I have not looked back, small business success is welcomed here, not shot down by Crabs.

I used to buy sh1t vans and second hand cars so it looked like I was not doing that well on the rock to stop the general Manx Crabs and the CS Crabs

The blob will have to be taken down of the place is to survive in any qualitative respect.

7 hours ago, Ringy Rose said:

Wait until you have to deal with HMRC, and get back to us about how everything is amazing on the adjacent island.

One of the great things about the Island was ringing the tax office

 You could speak to a human, and you probably knew them socially

[A fool and his money.....]

You have a point about red tape, ironically enough much of it is imported, it never used to be anywhere near as bad.

The rest is just glass half empty, negative bollocks. Business is infinitely doable here, it has its challenges everywhere, none here are insurmountable. If anything they serve a purpose. If someone is so easily put off setting up here then do we really want them? I think like new residents, there's plenty of room and work for anyone who would like to come here and appreciate the place for what it is. If we need to change the place just to accommodate their wishes, or throw money at them to live here then perhaps they aren't here for the right reasons.

It could well be argued that we are too business friendly here. Consumers and taxpayers are often disadvantaged as a result. I really don't see kowtowing to snowflake would be business owners would improve the situation.

[ADELE]

The Chamber of Commerce do not have many members when you consider the number of businesses on the Island.    Most of the members are big players and are out to protect their own interests and in no way do they represent the many businesses on he Island.   I doubt they have 100 members.

[jackwhite]

56 minutes ago, A fool and his money..... said:

You have a point about red tape, ironically enough much of it is imported, it never used to be anywhere near as bad.

The rest is just glass half empty, negative bollocks. Business is infinitely doable here, it has its challenges everywhere, none here are insurmountable. If anything they serve a purpose. If someone is so easily put off setting up here then do we really want them? I think like new residents, there's plenty of room and work for anyone who would like to come here and appreciate the place for what it is. If we need to change the place just to accommodate their wishes, or throw money at them to live here then perhaps they aren't here for the right reasons.

It could well be argued that we are too business friendly here. Consumers and taxpayers are often disadvantaged as a result. I really don't see kowtowing to snowflake would be business owners would improve the situation.

No one is asking you to 'kowtow', 'change to accommodate their wishes' or any other nonsense that you make up, as you are completely fabricating that. I didn't say any of that at all. 

What I would ask for is not to have open hostility. I was witness to a well known Manx publican state aggressively in the street that a business wouldn't open near him as he 'owned not only the street but Douglas'. The best of it was, the establishment he was talking about were the polar opposite to his and may actually have brought him new customers. They certainly wouldn't have taken them away from him.

You don't believe there's arrogance amongst businesses here because they've been here a long time? I've been involved in a handful of premises here and about half a dozen more that were considering it that decided not to, not because they are 'snowflakes' (although that very word in your post almost makes me dismiss the rest of it) but because they thought, why do I need the hassle? Four of them have since gone on elsewhere to be successful, one of them has developed into a chain of businesses across the UK (group of leisure establishments with different concepts at each) and one in particular is close to breaking into top bars in the UK. They would all have benefited the scene on the Isle of Man. They would all have given us something different to what we have here and none would have 'disadvantaged' consumers or the taxpayer. Can you tell me any business that actually does that?