Allinson ~ assisted dying won't be the "cause of death" to get life insurance payouts

[woolley]

13 hours ago, Albert Tatlock said:

Story of most MHKs under comin.

Manifestos turn to shoite.

Been that way for 30 yrs.

Robots that get unelected after one or maybe two terms.

We get what we vote for.

Not if they do a smart volte-face once elected, we don't.

[woolley]

3 hours ago, Roger Mexico said:

But the truth is that we don't really know how the UK will react.  They've approved things that they were opposing in the UK in the past (extending civil partnerships for example) and there will be a tendency to avoid controversy if they can. 

Someone will know. They do like to use the CDs as testing grounds sometimes.

3 hours ago, Two-lane said:

Is there a possibility that IoM politicians and Civil Servants have had unofficial discussions with their counterparts in the UK about this subject?

Of course, but not so much politicians. Have you never wondered why there is so little friction in the constitutional relationship? There is a steady hand on the tiller.

[woolley]

1 hour ago, Steve_Christian said:

Nope 100% incorrect about her father - he used to a own a book store and worked at Lloyds, and then as a night manager in hotels. And one member of my family used to go to Living hope but no longer does. Nice way to try and sully someone’s character by creating an untrue narrative about my family though. Thanks.  Hope that helps.

This is one thing that gets me down about the forum. I don't think it's right or acceptable to speculate about named individuals, particularly from behind a veil of anonymity. It's something I've always avoided unless I'm 100% certain of my facts. I suppose you can argue that if you enter public life you sign up for all the stupidity that goes with it, including the online keyboard warriors. Just doesn't seem fair to me.

[woolley]

20 minutes ago, code99 said:

Let’s hope that I am wrong about my concerns, but my main issue is that our peoples’ representatives could easily get out of their depths if at any time the operation of Assisted Dying legislation went awry. Because if something truly bad happened, then that could turn into another disaster for the Island.  

What is this something truly bad of which you speak? Could it be worse than the truly bad, terrifying things that are happening every day in homes, care homes and hospices? No legislation is going to be perfect, but if we can reduce the amount of suffering for the dying, and we can, then we absolutely should.

[HiVibes]

29 minutes ago, woolley said:

Jeez. Even more old chuffs! Could charge 'em, I suppose.

Get on the sudoku, no everyone with a terminal diagnosis is a useless old chuff. 

[Steve_Christian]

14 minutes ago, woolley said:

This is one thing that gets me down about the forum. I don't think it's right or acceptable to speculate about named individuals, particularly from behind a veil of anonymity. It's something I've always avoided unless I'm 100% certain of my facts. I suppose you can argue that if you enter public life you sign up for all the stupidity that goes with it, including the online keyboard warriors. Just doesn't seem fair to me.

Agreed. Which is why I am who I am and post under my real name. The abuse and online bullying and attacks people get is disgusting, and I’m sure it is a reason why we don’t get some more really good quality candidates putting themselves forward for public office. The irony is that a forum like this does all of those things, as highlighted above, and then moans that there aren’t any decent candidates. Members of this forum are part of the problem they complain about.

[woolley]

2 minutes ago, Steve_Christian said:

Agreed. Which is why I am who I am and post under my real name. The abuse and online bullying and attacks people get is disgusting, and I’m sure it is a reason why we don’t get some more really good quality candidates putting themselves forward for public office. The irony is that a forum like this does all of those things, as highlighted above, and then moans that there aren’t any decent candidates. Members of this forum are part of the problem they complain about.

OK, you have a point, but I do think that anonymity has a part to play, particularly in a small community. People have jobs, run businesses and they hold office. They may have things to say that are beneficial to society when put into the public domain, but which would never come out if they had to disclose their identity because of the possible adverse effect on their lives. It's something that should be used with care and responsibility though, and not to accuse others gratuitously of bigotry, and sometimes even criminality. There is a line and it needs to be approached with care and not crossed.

Incidentally, I do think that MF is better than some outlets in this respect. A lot of the stuff on the larger platforms is plainly actionable, and it isn't always anonymous either. Some people are idiots.

[Andy Onchan]

16 hours ago, Fred the shred said:

The Bishop dickhead who hasn’t said a lot since he arrived has come out with these pearls of wisdom as he steps on the boat or plane, whichever is operating atm to a cushy retirement after a very cushy time on the Island.     The new Bishop has not been appointed yet and it is slow process they do not rush these things   It would have been a perfect time to alter his terms and conditions i.e .   Stick to the church and keep your beak out of politics without fuss but it was not to be.   It must be very frustrating for new politicians to try and move forward when the old guard block every move.

 

You've contradicted yourself.... which is to be?

[Steve_Christian]

42 minutes ago, woolley said:

OK, you have a point, but I do think that anonymity has a part to play, particularly in a small community. People have jobs, run businesses and they hold office. They may have things to say that are beneficial to society when put into the public domain, but which would never come out if they had to disclose their identity because of the possible adverse effect on their lives. It's something that should be used with care and responsibility though, and not to accuse others gratuitously of bigotry, and sometimes even criminality. There is a line and it needs to be approached with care and not crossed.

Incidentally, I do think that MF is better than some outlets in this respect. A lot of the stuff on the larger platforms is plainly actionable, and it isn't always anonymous either. Some people are idiots.

I don’t agree - have the courage of your convictions and if you are uncomfortable saying something to someone’s face, or having your views attributed to you as a person, you shouldn’t be saying it - or you’re just a coward. The ability to hide one’s name shouldn’t give that person the right to say anything they choose. IMHO.

[Fred the shred]

How have I contradicted myself ?   

[code99]

1 hour ago, woolley said:

What is this something truly bad of which you speak? Could it be worse than the truly bad, terrifying things that are happening every day in homes, care homes and hospices? No legislation is going to be perfect, but if we can reduce the amount of suffering for the dying, and we can, then we absolutely should.

You are taking a very narrow perspective. I made it clear - I support the Bill, but there are myriads of issues that could go wrong as almost nothing in life is unassailable. The crucial bit is how issues are handled when things go wrong. E.g., ‘Lucy Letby Inquiry’ is going to review NHS culture and the UK will survive this horrific scandal. If something similar happened here, the damage (legal, reputational, political), not to mention victims and their families, to the Isle of Man could be devastating - the case of Dr Ranson tells you all you need to know…and worry about.

[Fred the shred]

What truly bad thing could happen that would be worse than deaths by sponsoring races where there are always casualties .   Hypocritical or what ?

[Fred the shred]

Claire Christian has been one of the drones in this government hopefully she will not be re elected.

[woolley]

41 minutes ago, Steve_Christian said:

I don’t agree - have the courage of your convictions and if you are uncomfortable saying something to someone’s face, or having your views attributed to you as a person, you shouldn’t be saying it - or you’re just a coward. The ability to hide one’s name shouldn’t give that person the right to say anything they choose. IMHO.

No it shouldn't bestow such a right to say anything they choose, not at all, and this was the thrust of my earlier response to you. However, there can be real world consequences attaching to the expression of perfectly reasonable views and information. We have whistleblower procedures and anonymous Crimestoppers lines for similar reasons. I think your stance is laudable but impractical in an imperfect world.

[jackwhite]

52 minutes ago, Fred the shred said:

Claire Christian has been one of the drones in this government hopefully she will not be re elected.

There was a lot of bluster by a lot of them when they were elected. 

The only new one I can genuinely think of that seems to challenge anything at all is Wannenburgh. Sorry, even you Stu, although I do realise you say there's a number of reasons. 

I was at the Government conference last year and it was all bravado. It was a great idea but nothing much seems to have happened. Our CM sinks further in my estimation almost every time I listen to a Tynwald debate and there's no one who really wants to challenge the status quo. The likes of Moorhouse seem to ask a lot of questions but don't actually appear to do much else. That said, the fact he's able to go to his gym 2 or 3 times a day makes me think the 'job' doesn't take up much of his time.

Edited November 1, 2023 by jackwhite