A fool and his money..... Posted May 19 Share Posted May 19 9 minutes ago, Happier diner said: You can fuck off. You dont know your arse from your elbow. You're welcome to highlight anything I've said that's incorrect. Why don't you just admit you're wrong? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CallMeCurious Posted May 19 Share Posted May 19 5 hours ago, 2112 said: More nonsense from IOMGs DoI this time it’s Minister Crookall justifying the DoIs decisions to purchase diesel vehicles. From the NPM - The Department of Infrastructure says it hasn't been buying electric vehicles for its fleet because they're too expensive and there's a lack of charging points. In a written Tynwald question, the minister revealed 135 non-electric vehicles had been bought since October 2022. Tim Crookall says most were ordered as diesel due to it being cheaper and there being no on-site or overnight charging points for them. 81 were ordered as diesel due to no on site/overnight charging points being available at this time, where vehicles are parked when not in use. Six of these were petrol/diesel hybrids. 51 vehicles fall into the classification of Light Commercial, Heavy Goods or 4x4 where electric options are limited due to powering ancillary equipment on the vehicle (ie, hoist, pump), range capacities or the difference in fully laden weight restrictions. 9 blue light emergency response vehicles where primarily the time to recharge an electric vehicle could have an impact on response times. Personally it’s freedom of choice over what type of vehicle, people buy, petrol, diesel or electric. However, IOMG has been legislating, hectoring and lecturing islanders about climate change, net zero and biosphere, yet a government department can’t practice what it preaches. Not a good example to set to others. Six of these were petrol/diesel hybrids. Wow, technology moves so fast. I knew we had petrol/electric hybrids and deisel/electric hybrids but petrol/deisel that's new? 🤪 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happier diner Posted May 20 Share Posted May 20 18 hours ago, A fool and his money..... said: You're welcome to highlight anything I've said that's incorrect. Why don't you just admit you're wrong? Reference What Size EV Charger Can I Install? Most people want the maximum amount of power to charge their vehicle. This requires putting in the highest amperage charger @ 240V. The main limiting factor for installing EV Chargers will be your electrical panel's allowable ampacity. The Electrical Code has rules for how many loads can be placed within a home based on its square footage and primary/large loads such as Ranges, Air Conditioners, Electric Heaters, Hot Tubs etc. To determine your home's available ampacity, Kuby Energy will conduct a Load Calculation. Many homes can put in a 20A or 30A charger with no upgrades, but many homes are at their existing amp limits with no EV charger. To get more ampacity, a Service Upgrade or an Electric Vehicle Management System will be required. A service upgrade will mean reinstalling the electrical lines from the utility companies transformer to your main electrical panel (ex. going from a 100A main bkr to a 200A main bkr). Service upgrades will vary depending on whether you have an underground or overhead service and what size service you desire. Typical fees for this may be in the $2,000 to $8,000 range. An EV Management System is a device which limits what loads can be on simultaneously - for example, if your EV charger is operating, you cannot turn on your range (or other equivalent large load). EV Management systems are typically more affordable than Service Upgrades, however, they may have lifestyle-limiting impacts and won't provide any extra ampacity for future electrical expansions. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yibble Posted May 20 Share Posted May 20 19 hours ago, CallMeCurious said: Six of these were petrol/diesel hybrids. Wow, technology moves so fast. I knew we had petrol/electric hybrids and deisel/electric hybrids but petrol/deisel that's new? 🤪 Not really that new: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hesselman_engine https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petrol-paraffin_engine 🙂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A fool and his money..... Posted May 20 Share Posted May 20 2 hours ago, Happier diner said: Reference What Size EV Charger Can I Install? Most people want the maximum amount of power to charge their vehicle. This requires putting in the highest amperage charger @ 240V. The main limiting factor for installing EV Chargers will be your electrical panel's allowable ampacity. The Electrical Code has rules for how many loads can be placed within a home based on its square footage and primary/large loads such as Ranges, Air Conditioners, Electric Heaters, Hot Tubs etc. To determine your home's available ampacity, Kuby Energy will conduct a Load Calculation. Many homes can put in a 20A or 30A charger with no upgrades, but many homes are at their existing amp limits with no EV charger. To get more ampacity, a Service Upgrade or an Electric Vehicle Management System will be required. A service upgrade will mean reinstalling the electrical lines from the utility companies transformer to your main electrical panel (ex. going from a 100A main bkr to a 200A main bkr). Service upgrades will vary depending on whether you have an underground or overhead service and what size service you desire. Typical fees for this may be in the $2,000 to $8,000 range. An EV Management System is a device which limits what loads can be on simultaneously - for example, if your EV charger is operating, you cannot turn on your range (or other equivalent large load). EV Management systems are typically more affordable than Service Upgrades, however, they may have lifestyle-limiting impacts and won't provide any extra ampacity for future electrical expansions. Relevant to public charging points how exactly? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happier diner Posted May 20 Share Posted May 20 (edited) 18 minutes ago, A fool and his money..... said: Relevant to public charging points how exactly? The charger doesn't know if its public or private. The same rule applies to any charging point. All electrical distribution systems have the equivalent of an electrical panel which contains fuses and they all have a finite capacity. The main limiting factor for installing EV Chargers will be your electrical panel's allowable ampacity Quiz Question for you. 1) Charlie has been given the job fitting a charging point for EVs in a sea terminal car park. He was told to make is a fast charger. In the first place he asked the local electricity supplier what the maximum load he could get at that point was 32KW. He wants 50KW for the charger he wants to fit. Does Charlie? a) Fit a 32KW charger as that's the maximum he can get b) Ignore the electricity supplier and listen to the advice of @A fool and his money..... and @Anthony Ingham and fit a 50KW because the power available it not important. c) Ask the electricity supplier if he can upgrade the electricity supply to the terminal by connecting to a nearby transmission line. Edited May 20 by Happier diner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A fool and his money..... Posted May 20 Share Posted May 20 17 minutes ago, Happier diner said: The charger doesn't know if its public or private. The same rule applies to any charging point. All electrical distribution systems have the equivalent of an electrical panel which contains fuses and they all have a finite capacity. The main limiting factor for installing EV Chargers will be your electrical panel's allowable ampacity Quiz Question for you. 1) Charlie has been given the job fitting a charging point for EVs in a sea terminal car park. He was told to make is a fast charger. In the first place he asked the local electricity supplier what the maximum load he could get at that point was 32KW. He wants 50KW for the charger he wants to fit. Does Charlie? a) Fit a 32KW charger as that's the maximum he can get b) Ignore the electricity supplier and listen to the advice of @A fool and his money..... and @Anthony Ingham and fit a 50KW because the power available it not important. c) Ask the electricity supplier if he can upgrade the electricity supply to the terminal by connecting to a nearby transmission line. The point you're missing, in preference to admitting that you are wrong, is that the electricity supplier has in fact installed as much capacity as will probably ever be needed by an EV charging point. If you're digging up the road you may as well eh. And so as a consequence, as I have explained many times, the power available is not the limiting factor in how quickly the EV is charged. At no point have I advised anyone to overload a supply, you've made that up. So let me ask you a question. Two EV's are connected to public charge points. One charge point has a supply capacity of 300MW, the other 500MW. Which would charge fastest? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happier diner Posted May 20 Share Posted May 20 17 minutes ago, A fool and his money..... said: The point you're missing, in preference to admitting that you are wrong, is that the electricity supplier has in fact installed as much capacity as will probably ever be needed by an EV charging point. If you're digging up the road you may as well eh. And so as a consequence, as I have explained many times, the power available is not the limiting factor in how quickly the EV is charged. At no point have I advised anyone to overload a supply, you've made that up. So let me ask you a question. Two EV's are connected to public charge points. One charge point has a supply capacity of 300MW, the other 500MW. Which would charge fastest? I never said you advised anyone to overload their supply. You have repeatedly said the power available in not important. It is. I am not and never have been wrong. The answer to your question - The same. The rate of charge is governed at the car end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cambon Posted May 20 Share Posted May 20 23 minutes ago, Happier diner said: The answer to your question - The same. The rate of charge is governed at the car end. This is actually correct. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WTF Posted May 20 Share Posted May 20 7 minutes ago, Cambon said: This is actually correct. yes, it's incredible isn't it. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A fool and his money..... Posted May 20 Share Posted May 20 1 hour ago, Happier diner said: I never said you advised anyone to overload their supply. You have repeatedly said the power available in not important. It is. I am not and never have been wrong. The answer to your question - The same. The rate of charge is governed at the car end. I've never said that power is not important, just that it's not the limiting factor. Finally you get it, they'll charge at exactly the same rate because the limiting factor is how quickly you can get the charge into the battery. This is a function of the battery technology which is an ever developing area, especially at the moment - and is subsequently likely to change, as are the charging points. You have constantly said that power is the limiting factor for these public charge points but now you are agreeing it's not - but you're not wrong and never have been!? I guess logic is less important to you than power. I give up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A fool and his money..... Posted May 20 Share Posted May 20 1 hour ago, Happier diner said: I never said you advised anyone to overload their supply. In the first place he asked the local electricity supplier what the maximum load he could get at that point was 32KW Ignore the electricity supplier and listen to the advice of @A fool and his money..... and @Anthony Ingham and fit a 50KW because the power available it not important. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happier diner Posted May 20 Share Posted May 20 18 minutes ago, A fool and his money..... said: I've never said that power is not important, just that it's not the limiting factor. Finally you get it, they'll charge at exactly the same rate because the limiting factor is how quickly you can get the charge into the battery. This is a function of the battery technology which is an ever developing area, especially at the moment - and is subsequently likely to change, as are the charging points. You have constantly said that power is the limiting factor for these public charge points but now you are agreeing it's not - but you're not wrong and never have been!? I guess logic is less important to you than power. I give up. Power is one of the limiting factors? Peace offering. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happier diner Posted May 20 Share Posted May 20 (edited) 17 minutes ago, A fool and his money..... said: In the first place he asked the local electricity supplier what the maximum load he could get at that point was 32KW Ignore the electricity supplier and listen to the advice of @A fool and his money..... and @Anthony Ingham and fit a 50KW because the power available it not important. Fair point. Fitting a bigger capacity charger doesn't necessarily mean you will oberload your power supply but I get what you mean. Edited May 20 by Happier diner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A fool and his money..... Posted May 20 Share Posted May 20 1 minute ago, Happier diner said: Power is one of the limiting factors? Peace offering. It isn't though. It could be in other circumstances, yes, but in the case of these public charge points, it isn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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