Another Bad Idea

[b4mbi]

I see Chris Thomas making noises that MDC and IOMSPC should be FOI'able.

Utter lunacy. Drowning them in bureaucracy is a fantastic way of motivating their staff to achieve their respective objectives. 

The shareholder has sufficient oversight already.

On the face of it this instinctively feels like such a bad idea...

What use is FOI anyway? Just a massive game of cat and mouse for bureaucrats, what has it revealed that has genuinely changed anything for the better? 

[StCatherine]

If they use / are underwritten by public money they should be transparent. Most FOIs come from people who can’t get a simple answer. 
 

Unfortunately the culture in government is to say no, or find a reason why you can’t just answer a straightforward question, that culture goes straight to the top. 

[english zloty]

Disagree. MDC seems to be doing fuck all very expensively. Why shouldn't they be publicly accountable.

[Non-Believer]

Mixed thoughts on this, I can see the value of the above but as the SPCo, at the end of the convoluted trail, had/has the backing of the taxpayers then they should also be accountable in respect of transparency.

FOI is consistently slated by those in Govt as being time and resource consuming but at the same time has served to reveal any amount of chicanery if not malpractice in our governance.

Edited December 15, 2023 by Non-Believer
Typo

[Weliveinhope]

2 minutes ago, Non-Believer said:

Mixed thoughts on this, I can see the value of the above but as the SPCo, at the end of the convoluted trail, is/has the backing of the taxpayers then they should also be accountable in respect of transparency.

FOI is consistently slated by those in Govt as being time and resource consuming but at the same time has served to reveal any amount of chicanery if not malpractice in our governance.

But nothing has changed as a result

[asitis]

There has always seemingly been some obfuscation where the SPCO is concerned, I'd still like to know why a report costing I believe it was 100K was embargoed and has never been released ! That would make interesting reading !

Wherever other peoples money is involved , nothing but total transparency should be expected to be the norm. Operational things which should be hidden should be restricted to some very narrow parameters and even then should be available to MHK's !

Then and only then, can proper oversight and auditing be achieved and the standard of decision making improved.

Edited December 15, 2023 by asitis

[Omobono]

1 hour ago, english zloty said:

Disagree. MDC seems to be doing fuck all very expensively. Why shouldn't they be publicly accountable.

with the amounts of money and borrowings involved  MDC should be  publicly accountable , after all they are a  quasi   government body 

[Shake me up Judy]

I remember that SPCO report well. It never saw the light of day and Henderson lost his ministerial post over it if I recall correctly. He came up against the Manx establishment. He's toed the line ever since and sits comfortably on the LegCo benches.  

[Non-Believer]

13 minutes ago, Shake me up Judy said:

I remember that SPCO report well. It never saw the light of day and Henderson lost his ministerial post over it if I recall correctly. He came up against the Manx establishment. He's toed the line ever since and sits comfortably on the LegCo benches.  

Which one did Robertshaw do that tore IRIS (?) to bits. That all went quiet too.

[manxman1980]

You just know that the SPCo would be inundated with requests wanting to know the details behind every single delayed or cancelled sailing. 

There would also be plenty requesting details on pricing structures.

It would absolutely swamp the SPCo 

[Andy Onchan]

25 minutes ago, Shake me up Judy said:

I remember that SPCO report well. It never saw the light of day and Henderson lost his ministerial post over it if I recall correctly. He came up against the Manx establishment. He's toed the line ever since and sits comfortably on the LegCo benches.  

I always thought Henderson was part of the Manx Establishment.

[Albert Tatlock]

FOI requests will be dependent on whether the Steam Racket is deemed to be a public authority or is subject to FOI due to government ownership. So that is the first question that needs to be answered (by a Tynwald vote IMO). Yes - or no?

FOI laws have limitations and exemptions, particularly when it comes to commercially sensitive information, personal data, or information that could adversely affect the company's competitive position. And this is what the government (with the Racket's backing) will likely hide behind. There will likely be a blanket 'No' IMO, rather than do any work and list what could be asked. The Steam Racket itself would have also have the right to object to being open to generic FOI on commercial grounds (on the basis that some other company could obtain an operational commercial advantage).

If the Racket were deemed 'public' and open to FOI, then some aspects of their operations or information might be accessible. FOI requests often need to be in the public interest or relate to matters of public concern, relating to: General service policies and procedures; Reports or statistics on service quality; Complaint handling processes; Financial reports (if related to the service provision); and Compliance with regulations and standards set by regulatory bodies. Personally, I think the compromise should be the government producing an annual audit on behalf of the public at least covering these generic topics. As a shareholder they have a right to know it is being run properly, as do the public that paid for it.

 

 

[Non-Believer]

20 minutes ago, Andy Onchan said:

I always thought Henderson was part of the Manx Establishment.

Invited into the cosy tent on condition that he didn't rock any boats. Duly proved that he knew which side his bread was buttered and has reaped the awards ever since including dodging the Lisvane-recommended pay amendments.

[Stu Peters]

The concept of the FOI system is fine, in principle. Their very existence makes people accountable and think twice.

However, they are being used primarily by people who have worn out their net curtains. Malcontents who want to put it to 'the man'. Maybe 5% of them (from what I'm aware of) are reasonable. Given the manpower taken up by them I'd levy a fee of £250 each.

Things were simpler under Mr Churchill. Nowadays there'd be a slew of FOI requests to see which beaches, who would be doing the fighting and whether a consultation had been carried out beforehand, by whom at what cost and was the job put out to tender. So I think I agree with b4mbi.

[asitis]

1 hour ago, Shake me up Judy said:

I remember that SPCO report well. It never saw the light of day and Henderson lost his ministerial post over it if I recall correctly. He came up against the Manx establishment. He's toed the line ever since and sits comfortably on the LegCo benches.  

I have a feeling there were some uncomfortable truths contained within that report which didn't fit with the urgent purchase at any price scenario !

That drawling Minister would know !