Moghrey Mie Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 ' In summary, it is not possible at this stage to measure the value for money of regional pools given that Government has not identified the role that it expects pools to play and defined what is important to it. However, in preparation for this it would be useful if Regional Pools and the NSC (and other government owned pools) could ensure that they had common and agreed accounting principles to ensure that all financial measures are consistent across all facilities.' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 2 hours ago, Non-Believer said: Edge now quoting a saving of £434k a year by closing the Southern pool. So if we don't employ another 54 Govt HR wankers at a quoted cost of £3M, that could keep the pool open for another 6 years. It's better than that because those 54 HR characters would cost us that £3m every year plus the cost of living increases and the annual increments on top that nobody talks about. I reckon we've saved at least £25m over those 6 years by keeping the swimming pool and binning the HR 54. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyDave Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 10 minutes ago, woolley said: It's better than that because those 54 HR characters would cost us that £3m every year plus the cost of living increases and the annual increments on top that nobody talks about. I reckon we've saved at least £25m over those 6 years by keeping the swimming pool and binning the HR 54. They would also generate tax and NI revenue. They would pay VAT on everything they buy, fuel duty etc etc. so a good chunk of their wages and even their future pension payments goes back into the economy. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finlo Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 3 minutes ago, CrazyDave said: They would also generate tax and NI revenue. They would pay VAT on everything they buy, fuel duty etc etc. so a good chunk of their wages and even their future pension payments goes back into the economy. No matter how you dress is up they are a net drain on the rest of us! 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairy Poppins Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 The situation with the Southern Pool seems to be symptomatic of the problems that are strangling life on the island in general. Whenever there is a suggestion to change or stop a service, there's various lobby groups that pop up and bombard MHKs with emails, phone calls and social media campaigns to protect their pet interests of X, Y, and Z. Then we have politicians commissioning numerous reports in the hope it will suggest taking unpopular actions, so they can blame the consultants as they don't have the backbone to take difficult decisions themselves. The root cause of the need to close or change a lot of things is the state of the island's public finances. I think Tynwald/IOM Government need to start being honest with the Manx Public, things simply cannot continue as they are much beyond the next 5 years. The simple reason is that based on the current trajectory of travel, Government will have burned through the remaining reserves. Taking £100m+ from reserves to prop up the revenue budget isn't healthy and certainly isn't sustainable. Then there's the half a billion pounds of Manx Utilities debt being 'serviced' at a cost of over £55m a year, much to the detriment of utility users on the island who are saddled with ever increasing charges. Isn't it strange how we expect Manx Gas/IEG to lower their prices in line with a fall in wholesale gas prices, yet at the same time MUA can up the cost of electricity (generated from gas) with no apparent justification? To top that off we now have MUA wanting to spend a further unspecified amount on windfarms and who knows what else, with no plan to pay off the existing debts. Comin then took on £400m+ debt in the form of the 'green bond' for a whole host of random projects - essentially papering over the ever growing cracks in the face of public finances. Then we have the £40m+ annual liability for the public sector pension black hole - a void that keeps growing and growing. This is all money that will be taken away from frontline services. Any attempt at making savings is met by resistance from assorted groups. Maybe the solution is direct democracy where the public vote on what to do... for example if a saving of C.£500k is needed, should we close the Southern Pool or the horse trams? Let the public decide. I'm not trying to knock the Isle of Man. I'm grateful to live here with my family, but I'm increasingly concerned about the state of public finances. Instead of being honest and trying to solve problems, it feels like Alf and Alex are just sending us hurtling faster and faster towards the abyss. 5 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 36 minutes ago, CrazyDave said: They would also generate tax and NI revenue. They would pay VAT on everything they buy, fuel duty etc etc. so a good chunk of their wages and even their future pension payments goes back into the economy. Yes, but with our effing money, all paid by us, and whilst providing nothing to benefit the public. So what about the cost of the swimming pool then on the same basis. People who work there pay tax and NI. They already pay VAT on everything they buy, fuel duty etc etc. so a good chunk of their wages and even their future pension payments goes back into the economy. And they actually do something useful. Are you real? 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred the shred Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 There is also the matter of the pensions that these people would be paid for years to come. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 5 minutes ago, Hairy Poppins said: The situation with the Southern Pool seems to be symptomatic of the problems that are strangling life on the island in general. The size of the government bureaucracy is doing that. Nothing else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mercenary Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 3 minutes ago, Fred the shred said: There is also the matter of the pensions that these people would be paid for years to come. Whichever way you spin it 54 is an absolutely huge number of people for any organisation over here, never mind when it's additional to an existing setup. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred the shred Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 I agree that is why aI mentioned the liability of paying pensions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyDave Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 4 minutes ago, Mercenary said: Whichever way you spin it 54 is an absolutely huge number of people for any organisation over here, never mind when it's additional to an existing setup. Have they committed to employing these 54 people? I thought it was just a recommendation from a report, so why are people moaning when I don’t believe it’s happened yet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 (edited) 13 minutes ago, CrazyDave said: Have they committed to employing these 54 people? I thought it was just a recommendation from a report, so why are people moaning when I don’t believe it’s happened yet? It is a recommendation from a report, but it sends out all the wrong signals. There's definitely no point in moaning afterwards! Even if they halve or quarter the number they take on, it's going in the wrong direction. The cost of government is killing us, and it is just not acceptable to cut services and provision to the public while continuing to grow their own number which absolutely needs to be reduced. Everyone knows it's staring us in the face, and it has been for over 25 years. Edited January 12 by woolley 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyDave Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 1 minute ago, woolley said: It is a recommendation from a report, but it sends out all the wrong signals. There's definitely no point in moaning afterwards! Even if they halve or quarter the number they take on, it's going in the wrong direction. The cost of government is killing us, and it is just not acceptable to cut services and provision to the public while continuing to grow their own number which absolutely needs to be reduced. Everyone knows it's staring us in the face, and it has been for over 25 years. But it might never happen, and is completely irrelevant in a conversation about spunking cash away on a swimming pool that we don’t need. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woolley Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 1 minute ago, CrazyDave said: But it might never happen, and is completely irrelevant in a conversation about spunking cash away on a swimming pool that we don’t need. It's exactly the time to kick off about it. Before they close the facility and before they spunk yet more cash away on yet more pointless employees that we don't need and that provide no benefit to the community into the bargain. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyDave Posted January 12 Share Posted January 12 6 minutes ago, woolley said: It's exactly the time to kick off about it. Before they close the facility and before they spunk yet more cash away on yet more pointless employees that we don't need and that provide no benefit to the community into the bargain. Disagree. The pool should have been closed already, and we don’t know they are going to employ more people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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