Happier diner Posted April 11 Share Posted April 11 2 hours ago, Jarndyce said: One example: Tynwald give Nobles a kicking every year when they "overspend" on their budget. But, IIRC, Nobles were not allowed to cross-charge DofE for any increased costs (staffing, drugs and services, etc) accrued as a result of TT and other motorsport events. Health care is free at the point at the point of delivery. Regardless of how caused. So, to re charge another department is not even something that has ever been considered and most likely never will. I understand what you are saying though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happier diner Posted April 11 Share Posted April 11 1 hour ago, mayhem said: My experience is that it does take time, is inefficient (particularly when budgets have been centralised to provide service) and managers spend a lot of time proclaiming they and their staff are profit centre serving their clients (other departments) and basically use the cross charging model to pretend they are running a business (internally). I’m very much a fan of justifying and quantifying things but the layers of bureaucracy and processes that they go through with the recharging is the issue not the recharging itself which I’m well aware is the norm in all medium + sized organisations (IOM is large by IOM standard but not by many other metrics) There are no layers of bureaucracy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarndyce Posted April 11 Share Posted April 11 16 minutes ago, Happier diner said: Health care is free at the point at the point of delivery. Regardless of how caused. So, to re charge another department is not even something that has ever been considered and most likely never will. I understand what you are saying though. I’m not sure that you do - this has nothing to do with healthcare being “free at the point of delivery”. What I’m saying is that if Nobles need to employ locum orthopods or locum ED staff for those two weeks of the year, they should be able to reclaim some funding from Enterprise to pay for it, as part of the “cost” of running the races. 3 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whiskey Posted April 11 Share Posted April 11 Desc have to pay the Doi for bus hire for trips, swimming etc too. Wondering how much money could be saved if this admin was removed. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mercenary Posted April 11 Share Posted April 11 2 minutes ago, Whiskey said: Desc have to pay the Doi for bus hire for trips, swimming etc too. Wondering how much money could be saved if this admin was removed. Well this is a good example of something that probably should be recharged at a realistic rate. In past years it's been contracted out, so at least if it's accounted for correctly they can review arrangements in the future to see if BV or private the better offering and have budget in place 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happier diner Posted April 12 Share Posted April 12 3 hours ago, Whiskey said: Desc have to pay the Doi for bus hire for trips, swimming etc too. Wondering how much money could be saved if this admin was removed. Very little. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happier diner Posted April 12 Share Posted April 12 5 hours ago, Jarndyce said: I’m not sure that you do - this has nothing to do with healthcare being “free at the point of delivery”. What I’m saying is that if Nobles need to employ locum orthopods or locum ED staff for those two weeks of the year, they should be able to reclaim some funding from Enterprise to pay for it, as part of the “cost” of running the races. That sounds a reasonable idea. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirty Buggane Posted April 12 Share Posted April 12 I would imagine going on past dealings with DBC it is cost + 30% for admin on recharge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holte End Posted April 12 Share Posted April 12 (edited) When do you think the Department of Home Affairs will start charging before they provide the service. So you ring 999, you will be then asked for your bank card details, only then will you be past on to the whichever service provider you require Police, Fire or Ambulance. They will clearly give service costs for each operation and you will be charge accordingly. Edited April 12 by Holte End Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gladys Posted April 12 Share Posted April 12 31 minutes ago, Holte End said: When do you think the Department of Home Affairs will start charging before they provide the service. So you ring 999, you will be then asked for your bank card details, only then will you be past on to the whichever service provider you require Police, Fire or Ambulance. They will clearly give service costs for each operation and you will be charge accordingly. Interdepartmental charging is far removed from charging the public for these services. We are not quite at the stage of the US model. For departments to charge other departments is really just an internal mechanism to make sure the costs of each department is correctly reflected within that department and is common and prudent accounting practice in the private sector. 2 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finlo Posted April 12 Share Posted April 12 29 minutes ago, Gladys said: Interdepartmental charging is far removed from charging the public for these services. We are not quite at the stage of the US model. For departments to charge other departments is really just an internal mechanism to make sure the costs of each department is correctly reflected within that department and is common and prudent accounting practice in the private sector. I wouldn't be so sure, when Parliament St flooded some years back the fire brigade were offering to pump the shopkeepers basements out @ £400 a pop! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gladys Posted April 12 Share Posted April 12 4 minutes ago, finlo said: I wouldn't be so sure, when Parliament St flooded some years back the fire brigade were offering to pump the shopkeepers basements out @ £400 a pop! As part of the repair process rather than disaster response? The alternative would be to engage a firm to pump out or hire your own pumps, I guess, and would be covered under insurance, surely? 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finlo Posted April 12 Share Posted April 12 1 minute ago, Gladys said: As part of the repair process rather than disaster response? The alternative would be to engage a firm to pump out or hire your own pumps, I guess, and would be covered under insurance, surely? While the event was happening, well after the tide was receding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted April 12 Share Posted April 12 16 hours ago, Happier diner said: If they didn't cross charge how would they know how much each department actually costs The biggest cost is usually staff. They should keep an evergreen document on how much a "fully loaded head" is which will vary from department to department and location to location. Includes pension, bennies, infrastructure like IT, heating and so forth. Just business as usual for a properly run organisation... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Omobono Posted April 12 Share Posted April 12 11 hours ago, Whiskey said: Desc have to pay the Doi for bus hire for trips, swimming etc too. Wondering how much money could be saved if this admin was removed. I know tours IOM were a lot cheaper , but it looks like Bus Vannin have the lot now including medical pickups patient transfers etc so in effect destroying anyone trying to provide a service in the private sector , I wonder if anyone on the value for money committee in government is looking at this and the true cost including gold plated pensions , 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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