wrighty Posted July 7 Share Posted July 7 1 minute ago, HeliX said: That seems like a reach. It's probably just familiarity - many of them had voted for him in previous elections, and considering he'd been in parliament for 40 years he's the only MP the vast majority of them had ever known. If he'd stood in a different constituency as an independent I reckon he'd not have done quite so well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeliX Posted July 7 Share Posted July 7 5 minutes ago, wrighty said: It's probably just familiarity - many of them had voted for him in previous elections, and considering he'd been in parliament for 40 years he's the only MP the vast majority of them had ever known. If he'd stood in a different constituency as an independent I reckon he'd not have done quite so well. Seems more plausible, but he did also run a good campaign. Faiza did incredibly well in her constituency despite nobody being under any illusion over whether she was out of the Labour party or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted July 7 Share Posted July 7 12 minutes ago, HeliX said: No. So it's not really George Galloway's fault that Labour lost a huge proportion of their Muslim voters. If you already know that answer why bother asking the question...? However that nice Keir Starmer wasn't in power until just the other day. Which means he had about as much influence over what's happening in Gaza (as per I'm assuming that's what this is all about) as you or I have. Galloway will jump on any old bandwagon he can to further his personal ambitions. If you think he actually cares about what's happening in Gaza then he's taken you, like many others, for mugs... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted July 7 Share Posted July 7 19 minutes ago, wrighty said: It's probably just familiarity - many of them had voted for him in previous elections, and considering he'd been in parliament for 40 years he's the only MP the vast majority of them had ever known. If he'd stood in a different constituency as an independent I reckon he'd not have done quite so well. He may simply have been a very good constituency MP who put in a lot of hard hours for his constituents. Contrast that with the likes of Truss... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeliX Posted July 7 Share Posted July 7 31 minutes ago, P.K. said: If you already know that answer why bother asking the question...? However that nice Keir Starmer wasn't in power until just the other day. Which means he had about as much influence over what's happening in Gaza (as per I'm assuming that's what this is all about) as you or I have. Galloway will jump on any old bandwagon he can to further his personal ambitions. If you think he actually cares about what's happening in Gaza then he's taken you, like many others, for mugs... Who was suggesting he had any influence over what's happening in Gaza? That doesn't mean he should be excused for stating that Israel has the right to cut off food and water to the entire population. I couldn't give two fucks about George Galloway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted July 7 Share Posted July 7 35 minutes ago, HeliX said: Who was suggesting he had any influence over what's happening in Gaza? That doesn't mean he should be excused for stating that Israel has the right to cut off food and water to the entire population. I couldn't give two fucks about George Galloway. He's entitled to his opinion in the same (surprising) way you are. I couldn't give two fucks what he may or may not have said about Gaza. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeliX Posted July 7 Share Posted July 7 1 minute ago, P.K. said: He's entitled to his opinion in the same (surprising) way you are. I couldn't give two fucks what he may or may not have said about Gaza. Who said he's not entitled to an opinion? I said that that opinion is a large part of why Labour lost a large chunk of its Muslim support. Conversations usually work better if you reply to what I said, not what you imagined. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted July 7 Share Posted July 7 Conversations work better if you don't ask questions you already know the answer to...! As to Labour losing Muslim support a lot of that will be down to the truly awful Galloway stirring it up for his own personal gratification. Fortunately the voters of Rochdale got rid of him at the first opportunity that presented itself... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeliX Posted July 7 Share Posted July 7 (edited) 45 minutes ago, P.K. said: Conversations work better if you don't ask questions you already know the answer to...! As to Labour losing Muslim support a lot of that will be down to the truly awful Galloway stirring it up for his own personal gratification. Fortunately the voters of Rochdale got rid of him at the first opportunity that presented itself... You think it's more likely to be the actions of George Galloway, which received next to no media coverage and next to nobody will have heard about, rather than the leader of the party supporting collective punishment of an entire population? Some level of delusion. Galloway's influence on hundreds of thousands of Muslim voters is so great that he can't even win in his own constituency. Edited July 7 by HeliX Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted July 7 Share Posted July 7 1 hour ago, HeliX said: You think it's more likely to be the actions of George Galloway, which received next to no media coverage and next to nobody will have heard about, rather than the leader of the party supporting collective punishment of an entire population? Some level of delusion. Galloway's influence on hundreds of thousands of Muslim voters is so great that he can't even win in his own constituency. Nope. You're also wrong about nobody knowing about Galloway's rep. And he did win in his constituency but was binned off ASAFP. Now religion and politics are a very bad mix and the rise of Reform UK should be a cause for everyone's concern. But like those in Gaza you're going nowhere with this... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manxman1980 Posted July 7 Share Posted July 7 1 hour ago, P.K. said: Nope. You're also wrong about nobody knowing about Galloway's rep. And he did win in his constituency but was binned off ASAFP. Now religion and politics are a very bad mix and the rise of Reform UK should be a cause for everyone's concern. But like those in Gaza you're going nowhere with this... Galloways win was directly linked to Gaza and the withdrawal of the Labour candidate in the area for comments they had made. The fact he has now been booted out shows you it was a protest vote. That said, Labour do need to be mindful that they have a very diverse base who voted for them. Keeping them all happy is not going to be easy and may open the door for more extremists like Galloway and Reform UK to win seats at any by-elections. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Declan Posted July 7 Share Posted July 7 7 hours ago, wrighty said: The reason Corbyn did so well this time, apparently, is most of the people voting for him thought they were voting labour, because they're too stupid to know that he was standing as an independent having been kicked out by the party. So said Peter Mandelson, I think. Nonesense. The party name is on the ballot. I’d have voted Corbyn in Islington and Starmer in Camden. I think it’s rather pointless comparing their vote share, circumstances are different. 2017 and 2019 were in part about Brexit. Only PK is still fighting that battle. I’ve not heard it mentioned but I think the story of this election is the floating voters could live with Starmer being PM when they couldn’t Corbyn. So although they weren’t enthusiastic they could stay home and let him win. Also because the polls were so much in his favour the centre and left could vote Lib Dem or Green or the pro-Palestine independents or whoever they preferred without risking a Tory win. So if Reform hadn’t split the right Labour would have got more of the centre and left’s votes. Corbyn when he was leader did well in getting the Left out and enthusiastic. But unless a populist left leader can get the people who never vote to vote, there just aren’t enough on the left to win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted July 7 Share Posted July 7 1 hour ago, Declan said: I think it’s rather pointless comparing their vote share, circumstances are different. 2017 and 2019 were in part about Brexit. Only PK is still fighting that battle. @Declan So what is your explanation for the considerable shift from Conservative to Reform UK? Please don't try it on with "protest vote against the establishment" because if it was I would expect more Labour losses which simply didn't happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.K. Posted July 7 Share Posted July 7 1 hour ago, manxman1980 said: Galloways win was directly linked to Gaza and the withdrawal of the Labour candidate in the area for comments they had made. The fact he has now been booted out shows you it was a protest vote. That said, Labour do need to be mindful that they have a very diverse base who voted for them. Keeping them all happy is not going to be easy and may open the door for more extremists like Galloway and Reform UK to win seats at any by-elections. The issue I have is with the Labour candidate being withdrawn for essentially criticising the Knesset. Which to me is not anti-semitic. It's just criticising a government for letting it's guard down which led to the Hamas assault. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paswt Posted July 7 Share Posted July 7 9 hours ago, wrighty said: The reason Corbyn did so well this time, apparently, is most of the people voting for him thought they were voting labour, because they're too stupid to know that he was standing as an independent having been kicked out by the party. So said Peter Mandelson, I think. Mr Corbyn was my MP for over 20 years when I lived in islington , he was an excellent constituency MP. I did not agree with many of his views but he stuck to his guns . He did not take gifts which he had to declare ( other that a ticket to Glastonbury where he spoke ) whereas the leader of the party who binned him off allegedly declared £65K ( surprising given his remuneration received over the years ?) . I knew and met Mr Corbyn and IMO he was not an anti semite . One could argue that the now Prime Minister has Zionist leanings given he thinks it is acceptable for Isreal to prevent a civilian population from having access to food and water . If I was still living in Islington I would vote for him again , at least he hasn't been bought . Mandelson views are clearly motivated by malice and are irrelevant . Just saying 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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