On the Buses

[Tinpot]

25 minutes ago, Two-lane said:

People on this forum are mostly pointing out that the purpose of the DoI is to serve the tax payers. Peters does not see that point of view. His comment is a defence of the actions of the DoI.

Is part of the duty of the DOI to minimise cost to the public?

I would imagine that private hires are much more lucrative than a normal bus route?

It sounds like a difficult balancing act to me, which the majority of the time they manage fairly well.

[Will Halsall]

3 hours ago, Banker said:

If the buses were run as a commercial profit making operation then at least 50% of the bus service would be axed and the remaining buses would run to schedule without issues, saving the tax payers £m each year. People wanting Cregneash buses run for a few people daily are the same whiners about other services being cancelled 
 

All these government entities like buses , sports venues, theatres should be run by private companies with small subsidies if necessary. 

Be careful what you wish for, this is from the Labour manifesto:

Since buses were deregulated in 1985, bus services in England’s regions outside London have collapsed, with:

• 1.5 billion fewer annual bus journeys in 2019 than in 1985
• Almost 300 million fewer miles driven by buses per year since 2010
• Thousands of bus services cut since 2010

 

[Non-Believer]

17 minutes ago, Tinpot said:

Is part of the duty of the DOI to minimise cost to the public?

Undoubtedly. Are they successful at it? Rarely, if ever.

In this case, the policies of having proven incompetents on huge salaries declaring that cutting the wages of people with responsibilities for the public safety, further down the chain to the point where public services are damaged is not the way forward.

It is the culture of the two-tier society with the upper tier interested only in preserving its own entitlements.

[x-in-man]

I was chatting to someone across the other day and they said an area they had visited recently had a free bus service for all, 365 days a year.  It was paid for from a 'Tourist Tax'.  A couple of pounds per day paid for free buses for all.

Don't know the latest visitor figures (including bikes stuff and cruise ships) but a couple of quid a day from each of them could raise ... fag packet calculations here ..  about a tenner.  Yeah I know that tenner would be lost in paperwork, form filling and general Government internal invoicing fuck-whitery - but get those 5million+ visiting a year  - what with the airport extension, harbour plans and new quayside developments, it'll go long way to giving the Island a free bus service for all of us - all year.

[Moghrey Mie]

6 minutes ago, x-in-man said:

I was chatting to someone across the other day and they said an area they had visited recently had a free bus service for all, 365 days a year.  It was paid for from a 'Tourist Tax'.  A couple of pounds per day paid for free buses for all.

Don't know the latest visitor figures (including bikes stuff and cruise ships) but a couple of quid a day from each of them could raise ... fag packet calculations here ..  about a tenner.  Yeah I know that tenner would be lost in paperwork, form filling and general Government internal invoicing fuck-whitery - but get those 5million+ visiting a year  - what with the airport extension, harbour plans and new quayside developments, it'll go long way to giving the Island a free bus service for all of us - all year.

Make it Round For A Pound and you would probably get lots more people using the buses.

[english zloty]

8 minutes ago, x-in-man said:

I was chatting to someone across the other day and they said an area they had visited recently had a free bus service for all, 365 days a year.  It was paid for from a 'Tourist Tax'.  A couple of pounds per day paid for free buses for all.

Don't know the latest visitor figures (including bikes stuff and cruise ships) but a couple of quid a day from each of them could raise ... fag packet calculations here ..  about a tenner.  Yeah I know that tenner would be lost in paperwork, form filling and general Government internal invoicing fuck-whitery - but get those 5million+ visiting a year  - what with the airport extension, harbour plans and new quayside developments, it'll go long way to giving the Island a free bus service for all of us - all year.

It’s a lovely idea but we all know that the extra money will be spaffed on a tourist tax administration division which will cost more to staff than it brings in. 

[Banker]

3 hours ago, Will Halsall said:

 

Be careful what you wish for, this is from the Labour manifesto:

Since buses were deregulated in 1985, bus services in England’s regions outside London have collapsed, with:

• 1.5 billion fewer annual bus journeys in 2019 than in 1985
• Almost 300 million fewer miles driven by buses per year since 2010
• Thousands of bus services cut since 2010

 

That’s because most routes are massively loss making so man6 need cutting, if drivers were paid more or more routes added like cregneash then obviously losses would be more. So do residents want higher taxes to fund more routes, higher wages etc as there is no other solution or perhaps massive increase in prices and stop the free bus passes for oldies.

 

 

[Nellie]

1 hour ago, Banker said:

That’s because most routes are massively loss making so man6 need cutting, if drivers were paid more or more routes added like cregneash then obviously losses would be more. So do residents want higher taxes to fund more routes, higher wages etc as there is no other solution or perhaps massive increase in prices and stop the free bus passes for oldies.

 

 

Bus Vannin have said before that the only routes that 'are profitable' are the 1/2/12 group from Onchan-Douglas-Airport-Port Erin/Port St Mary.

That said, it is unclear if their version of 'profitable' would include their management structure, shared service costs (HR, Payroll etc.), Occupation Costs (a valuable depot site in Douglas) , Capital Costs and Depreciation, or is just wages and fuel!

[Will Halsall]

1 hour ago, Banker said:

That’s because most routes are massively loss making so man6 need cutting, if drivers were paid more or more routes added like cregneash then obviously losses would be more. So do residents want higher taxes to fund more routes, higher wages etc as there is no other solution or perhaps massive increase in prices and stop the free bus passes for oldies.

 

 

At the end of the day it's a bus Service, and the associated costs to service communities, school children and tourists too should be paid for by our taxes imo. The reality is that between Longworth, Black, Cregeen, Crookall, Bell, CoMin (between 2011 and now) have completely fucked BV up by a mixture of arrogance and stupidity - the arrogance of Longworth treating all IOM Passenger Transport as his own personal fiefdom, and the stupidity of all the others (mentioned above) believing that someone who talks with authority must be right.

I recall DCCL using creative accountancy to get rid of their old stock to justify all of the Vitaro's, and I doubt very much that these routes are to qoute you 'massively' loss making, and I certainly wouldn't believe anything that Crookall said without independent verification. 

 

[A fool and his money.....]

5 hours ago, Tinpot said:

Is part of the duty of the DOI to minimise cost to the public?

Not at the cost of the public service they provide. Especially something as vital as public transport.

Bus services are already a poor shadow of what they used to be, the last thing we need is for the ones we have left to become unreliable and unpredictable.

The idea of cancelling scheduled public transport services in favour of private cruise ship hires during a self-declared climate emergency is completely mental!

Quite aside from the obvious and ever increasing disregard it shows for the people of the island.

We were happy enough to throw a boat full of soggy bikers out in the midnight rain because we couldn't be arsed keeping the sea terminal open - but at the thought of a few half-day cruise ship passengers having to walk a few hundred metres or use public transport, we move heaven and earth.

Leave them on the harbour side and tell them they should have travel insurance!

[Two-lane]

7 minutes ago, A fool and his money..... said:

cruise ship hires during a self-declared climate emergency is completely mental!

The mpg per passenger figures for a cruise ship are pretty spectacular. The ship's consumption is probably beaten only by a Saturn V rocket.

The gov. twittering about net-zero and at the same time encouraging cruise ships is a bit hypocritical.

[Passing Time]

I see Longtail was out driving a bus today. Funny how he only drives either Saturday or Sunday. Double time nothing to do with it I suppose...

[Tinpot]

11 minutes ago, Passing Time said:

I see Longtail was out driving a bus today. Funny how he only drives either Saturday or Sunday. Double time nothing to do with it I suppose...

Jeez.

People were loaning last week when they cancelled a few.

Today, they have people in helping out to make sure they aren’t cancelled and people still moan 🙄

[A fool and his money.....]

Directly benefiting from a situation he has created. Just shows the integrity of the man.

[Non-Believer]

I don't know anything about Longworth's pay rate but after what that man has inflicted on IoM taxpayers re. bus situation, his "contribution" to the Promenade and whatever else, he should have been shown the door and told, Services no longer Required - Go.