nipper Posted October 9, 2005 Share Posted October 9, 2005 During the summer months the sea is tested in 3 places on Douglas beach. This website gives a bit of info. Sea Water Testing - Isle of Man The results for this year are on lamp posts along Douglas Promenade. Broadway, Hilton and I think bottom of Summerhill somewhere. Regarding the whey. It seems that this does not flow all the time but is released from the creamery periodically. Can anyone confirm this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nipper Posted October 9, 2005 Share Posted October 9, 2005 During the summer months the sea is tested in 3 places on Douglas beach. This website gives a bit of info. Sea Water Testing - Isle of Man Typically for Government websites, the results are out of date. Perhaps the "Webmaster" got bored with the internet once the novelty ended. The results for this year are on lamp posts along Douglas Promenade. Broadway, Hilton and I think bottom of Summerhill somewhere. Regarding the whey. It seems that this does not flow all the time but is released from the creamery periodically. Can anyone confirm this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gladys Posted October 9, 2005 Share Posted October 9, 2005 Yes, you can see it from my office, every now and again there is a cloudy plume in the bay which you can't see from sea level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctor bob Posted October 9, 2005 Share Posted October 9, 2005 Also, I think they use a strain of e coli to ferment the whey to reduce the lactose. In which case they would know what it is already. At any rate I don't think the link between e coli and whey is from some external source, if it were that would be even more alarming, so a clear explanation as to the practices at the dairy needs to be forthcoming pretty sharpish. This is as likely as an egg company adding salmonella to their eggs! A friend of mine made cheese at the Creamery for many years and says they test all products for e-coli to make sure there isn't any in them. They do put friendly bacteria into yogurt and cheese - listen to the adverts on telly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Educa Posted October 9, 2005 Share Posted October 9, 2005 I've not put my dogs into the water in Douglas Beach for many a year after being told not to by the Vet. I used to put the dogs in the sea as, imo, it is good for their coat and gives them a good skin condition. However after my dogs having stomach probs at the same time, I took them to the vet and that is what I was told. One of our dogs used to get sick tummy...after a walk on Douglas beach...so we haven't walked them there fore quite a long time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Woo Posted October 9, 2005 Share Posted October 9, 2005 Also, I think they use a strain of e coli to ferment the whey to reduce the lactose. In which case they would know what it is already. At any rate I don't think the link between e coli and whey is from some external source, if it were that would be even more alarming, so a clear explanation as to the practices at the dairy needs to be forthcoming pretty sharpish. This is as likely as an egg company adding salmonella to their eggs! A friend of mine made cheese at the Creamery for many years and says they test all products for e-coli to make sure there isn't any in them. They do put friendly bacteria into yogurt and cheese - listen to the adverts on telly. I'm just reporting facts. I think it was pointed out earlier that most strains of e coli are harmless, or friendly as you would have it so I don't understand your comparison to salmonella in eggs. Anyway regardless of what you may think, in order to reduce the lactose content in whey the recombinant and ethanologenic E. coli KO11 can be used fairly effectively. I don't know if it is here or not which is why I suggested that they shoud state what strain it is. In Iran, for instance whey is discharged into rivers untreated causing major problems. Brazil uses E. coli KO11 to some effect, apparently. I would be interested to know what process the dairy uses to downgrade the whey, if any. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sarahc Posted October 10, 2005 Share Posted October 10, 2005 From what I can tell by the reproduced stories here and listening to Manx Radio over the weekend, Douglas Corporation and Manx Radio made a mountain over a molehill and had to make a significant climbdown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MALLET Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 Must say that looking at the water there seems a mass improvement within the bay over the last year or so, then I looked into treating whey produced from milk products and found that for full effective cleaning it would require a pre treatment works being installed at the creamery before before pumping into existing waste system. But looks like someone looked at the cost and thought hmmm pipeline already down broadway little work and cost effective to just dump the stuff in the water. So millions spent to remove the s***e from the water just to gain a substance that needs pre treating before normal methods will handle it........Just look into the methods across for treating the stuff..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squaddie Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 Also, I think they use a strain of e coli to ferment the whey to reduce the lactose. In which case they would know what it is already. At any rate I don't think the link between e coli and whey is from some external source, if it were that would be even more alarming, so a clear explanation as to the practices at the dairy needs to be forthcoming pretty sharpish. This is as likely as an egg company adding salmonella to their eggs! A friend of mine made cheese at the Creamery for many years and says they test all products for e-coli to make sure there isn't any in them. They do put friendly bacteria into yogurt and cheese - listen to the adverts on telly. I'm just reporting facts. I think it was pointed out earlier that most strains of e coli are harmless, or friendly as you would have it so I don't understand your comparison to salmonella in eggs. Anyway regardless of what you may think, in order to reduce the lactose content in whey the recombinant and ethanologenic E. coli KO11 can be used fairly effectively. I don't know if it is here or not which is why I suggested that they shoud state what strain it is. In Iran, for instance whey is discharged into rivers untreated causing major problems. Brazil uses E. coli KO11 to some effect, apparently. I would be interested to know what process the dairy uses to downgrade the whey, if any. Okay the procedure here is: 1. The milk arrives in tankers from the local farms and is tested upon arrival. It is then pumped into storage tanks. 2. It is then pumped through Process Control where it is pasturised. 3. The milk hall then receives it`s quota which it stores in tanks inside the hall from where the containers we have in our fridges are filled. 4. The cheeseroom then receives the milk needed to produce the cheese. 5. The cheese is made by adding the required bacteria for the type of cheese to be made, whether it be Red Leicester, Cheddar, Chesire etc. The bacteria used is friendly and at no time ever is a strain of E. Coli used! 6. The by product of cheese, being whey is then drained off leaving the curd which forms the cheese. This whey goes to storage tanks outside the building. The majoity of this whey is used by the islands pig farmers as foodstuff. Every step of the way the produce is tested extensively in the labarotory on site. Everything that touches the produce and waste products is also extensively tested and thoroughly cleaned at very high temperatures with the required chemicals. So this leaves a couple of choices: 1. The Creameries are not performing correctly and the testing in the laboratory is not being carried properly. 2. The source of this problem lies in the pipeline running into the sea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rab Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 5. The cheese is made by adding the required bacteria for the type of cheese to be made, whether it be Red Leicester, Cheddar, Chesire etc. The bacteria used is friendly and at no time ever is a strain of E. Coli used! I think the point Mr Woo was making is that E. Coli is used is the treatment of the waste product - whey. At no time was it suggested that they use it in the process of making Cheese! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Woo Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 5. The cheese is made by adding the required bacteria for the type of cheese to be made, whether it be Red Leicester, Cheddar, Chesire etc. The bacteria used is friendly and at no time ever is a strain of E. Coli used! I think the point Mr Woo was making is that E. Coli is used is the treatment of the waste product - whey. At no time was it suggested that they use it in the process of making Cheese! Thanks for taking the time to read what I said Rab. Right back at the beginning of this, I pointed out that in some places, Brazil being one, a strain of E.Coli is used to downgrade the lactose in the whey. I didn't know at the time if it is here but apparently not or we would have been told by now. I pointed this out because it could have been an innocuous reason for the presence of E-Coli at the outlet. I was really saying don't panic until we know: a. If it's a nasty form of E. Coli and: b. If it had been added to aid in the downgrading. That was why I said they should tell us sharpish what their practices are. I wasn't aware that I had written so ambiguously, and I'm sure I wasn't the only one to mention that there is "friendly" e-coli. How do you think they make Bailey's Irish Cream? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeyconcrete Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 How do other cheese-makers dispose of their whey? A quick search on google suggests that there's a cost associated with the disposal of whey so many companies are looking for alternative methods (processing into animal feed etc) to get rid of it. Do IOM Creameries pay any kind of waste disposal fee/tax to enable them to pump the stuff into the sea. I always thought it kinda defeated the point, spending millions to stop pumping crap into the sea only to replace it with other junk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Woo Posted October 14, 2005 Share Posted October 14, 2005 5. The cheese is made by adding the required bacteria for the type of cheese to be made, whether it be Red Leicester, Cheddar, Chesire etc. The bacteria used is friendly and at no time ever is a strain of E. Coli used! I didn't suggest that it was. I was describing a possible treatment of the waste product, whey. 6. The by product of cheese, being whey is then drained off leaving the curd which forms the cheese. This whey goes to storage tanks outside the building. The majoity of this whey is used by the islands pig farmers as foodstuff. So if the pre-treatment of the whey isn't the one I described, what is? Or is the whey discharged untreated? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squaddie Posted October 15, 2005 Share Posted October 15, 2005 5. The cheese is made by adding the required bacteria for the type of cheese to be made, whether it be Red Leicester, Cheddar, Chesire etc. The bacteria used is friendly and at no time ever is a strain of E. Coli used! I didn't suggest that it was. I was describing a possible treatment of the waste product, whey. 6. The by product of cheese, being whey is then drained off leaving the curd which forms the cheese. This whey goes to storage tanks outside the building. The majoity of this whey is used by the islands pig farmers as foodstuff. So if the pre-treatment of the whey isn't the one I described, what is? Or is the whey discharged untreated? Maybe my comment is not explained correctly: When I stated that E.Coli is not used it reads like I was talking about in the process of making cheese only. I meant to say that it is never used in any process there as far as i know. Crossed wires there me thinks. hehe As to the treatment of the whey once deposited into the storage tanks I know not except the majority if not all of it is used by pig farmers. I`m not sure how it would work, but if this whey does become infected with the virus somehow then would the pigs be affected also? I do not profess to be an expert on the matter but what little knowledge I do possess I have shared with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Woo Posted October 15, 2005 Share Posted October 15, 2005 I do not profess to be an expert on the matter but what little knowledge I do possess I have shared with you. Fair enough Squaddie, me neither and ditto! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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