P.K. Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 Some maintain that the changing of the citizenship of the Islanders from Brit Cit to Cit of Islands and dependancies was the spur to invasion. I was in favour of giving the Islands to Argie cos, lets be honest, looking ot the map, they seem to want to be Argie. Then i heard an explanation from a diplomat on TV, he said HMG would like to have handed over the Islands but with the regime in Argie, arrests without trial, torture, assasinations, people disappearing, well they couldnt hand over our citezens to such a repressive regime---i agreed. Their citizenship was changed in line with all the Crown Dependancies at the same time. This was simply a cynical ploy by Thatcher to prevent lots of Hong Kong citizens legally heading for the UK prior to the Chinese takeover. I was also caught up in it and had to attend the Home Office to "regularize my status" because of that appalling woman. "Giving up" the islands? They're a British Overseas Territory whose inhabitants are proud of being British, and as such their laws are the same as in the UK - other OTs are Bermuda, Anguilla, BVI, Caymans, Gibraltar etc. I dont' see how she could have just "given them up" no matter if she had wanted to or not. Her defence cuts included HMS Endurance which sent a clear signal to Argentina that negotiations to share sovereignty (and therefore costs) were on the way. In time they would have been completely ceded. We are talking Margaret Thatcher here. Do you honestly think she would give a toss about a couple of hundred folks who would never vote for her? Get real. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheesemonster2005 Posted December 12, 2005 Author Share Posted December 12, 2005 But a majority voted in favour of devolution in 1979. But it was scrapped on a technicality. Source That's true. But in order for devolution to be set-up more than 40% needed to actually bother casting a vote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheesemonster2005 Posted December 12, 2005 Author Share Posted December 12, 2005 Now her handling of the Poll Tax in Scotland etc etc ... there I'd say you were making reasonable points ... but devolution was a non-issue after the referendum failed and I really don't think you can blame Maggie for it! Apparently Maggie thought that people would like the Poll Tax (or community charge, or whatever). The Scottish weren't too happy at being used as guinea pigs and looks like they still aren't - do the Tories have an MP yet in Scotland? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ans Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 do the Tories have an MP yet in Scotland? Yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles Flynn Posted December 13, 2005 Share Posted December 13, 2005 Carol Thatcher says her mother is going senile. Some would argue this is good timing as it stops her being investigated for any alleged past misdeeds. I believe it is simply a fact that as people live longer they will be subject to a variety of physical and mental ailments. but certainly for some politicians like Pinochet it can be a useful escape route. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Declan Posted December 13, 2005 Share Posted December 13, 2005 Chinahand the link I gave did say that, and went to the specific section of the page that said that. I tend to view it that if you don't vote your opinion doesn't count. You certainly can't count their vote either way. But to use the same method of calculation you did - Maggie got 43.9% of the vote in 1979 on a turnout of 76%. So she was elected by 33.33% of the population voting for her. Fewer than that in Scotland. And she used that as a mandate to keep devolution off the agenda. Seems wrong to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Old Git Posted December 13, 2005 Share Posted December 13, 2005 I tend to view it that if you don't vote your opinion doesn't count. You certainly can't count their vote either way. A club that I'm a member of has regular votes and the people who don't turn up to vote are counted as not voting "yes" so in effect they're voting no. It can make it hard to get things done. But to use the same method of calculation you did - Maggie got 43.9% of the vote in 1979 on a turnout of 76%. So she was elected by 33.33% of the population voting for her. Fewer than that in Scotland. And she used that as a mandate to keep devolution off the agenda. Seems wrong to me. How many people actually voted for the present government? Edit - the answer "This was despite polling only 36% of the popular vote, equating to approximately 22% of the electorate based on the estimated turnout of 61.3%" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheesemonster2005 Posted December 13, 2005 Author Share Posted December 13, 2005 Carol Thatcher says her mother is going senile. She started this long process in 1979. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Declan Posted December 13, 2005 Share Posted December 13, 2005 How many people actually voted for the present government? Edit - the answer "This was despite polling only 36% of the popular vote, equating to approximately 22% of the electorate based on the estimated turnout of 61.3%" Which is yet another reason for Propotional Representation. But that's another debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FinloYessir Posted December 13, 2005 Share Posted December 13, 2005 Considering he was born in 1980 or 81, he wasn't even alive under that Government and he was a whopping 9 or 10 when Thatcher's reign ended. I think it's safe to say he's just parrotting what someone else has told him without fully understanding anything about it but it's cool to rage against the machine! It's pretty much not cool to wish ill health and death on somoene you don't know though, that's pretty pathetic and very immature. I'm fully aware of history and politics Ans. Yes, you're right that I wasn't alive before Maggie's rule but her effects are still being felt today and many people are aware of it. At least Jonty also finds the news uplifting. And you don't even live in the country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simon Posted December 13, 2005 Share Posted December 13, 2005 A club that I'm a member of has regular votes and the people who don't turn up to vote are counted as not voting "yes" so in effect they're voting no. It can make it hard to get things done. Maybe the club could do with defining a 'quorum' and whether proxy votes are valid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Old Git Posted December 13, 2005 Share Posted December 13, 2005 Shouldn't be a problem next year as the people who didn't attend regular meetings are resigning from the club, not from any fall out but just a waning interest. It is an investment club BTW so the regular votes were to do with investment decisions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simon Posted December 13, 2005 Share Posted December 13, 2005 /ot - you could start an interesting thread about investment clubs. We had one at school (well virtual investments / stock picking). I remember picking AB Electronics just before they got the contract to fabricate the BBC Micro. A Manx Forums investment club might be interesting too. Perhaps some of the folk here have got some good insider tips Either real or virtual. Maybe one for the 'boardroom'. Must have been annoying trying to pick stocks when people weren't voting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Declan Posted December 13, 2005 Share Posted December 13, 2005 A Manx Forums investment club might be interesting too. Perhaps some of the folk here have got some good insider tips . Crumlin? Manxchatterbox? FCMR? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheesemonster2005 Posted December 13, 2005 Author Share Posted December 13, 2005 I'm fully aware of history and politics Ans. Yes, you're right that I wasn't alive before Maggie's rule but her effects are still being felt today and many people are aware of it. And you don't even live in the country. True but before living where I am now I spent the previous 6 years living in the UK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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