The Reality Of The Mea Saga....

[TheTool]

The thing is nowadays the governement are just a bunch of spin doctors, most people will read those snippets in the paper and be so confused that they give up after 2 mins of reading.

 

This is why they word there propagander in such a way that it bores the average man/woman shitless.

 

They seem to like to gloss things over just like blair and his rabble of prats.

 

nevermind election time soon so if you mhk's are reading this invest your wages wisely

[LoneWolf]

Tool, I think it is very difficult to compare like with like: the MEA installed the worlds longest AC cable,

 

ChinaHand we need to put this one to bed. The reason MEA have the world's longest AC cable is because no one else in their right mind would lay an AC cable that length. Substitute "most inefficient" for longest and you are talking facts. To be fair the cable capacity didnt warrant the capital outlay on DC Convertors. Even allowing for the inefficiency of the AC cable the cost of wholesale power in the UK was so much cheaper than home generated power that it was worthwhile.

It also seems to have crept into MEA folklore that Mike Proffitt commissioned the Cable. He didnt. It was brought in during the time a chap called Machin was CEO. The cable was built and commissioned in partnership with National Grid. It is something of a mystery as to why MEA later thought it necessary to buy out National Grid, the more so as the gas project was already well over plan and the money was taken from the gas project funding. Possibly something to do with covert plans for the Manx Cable Company ? Or am I being cynical ?

 

built something like 30 miles of gas pipeline, provided all the support infrastructure for domestic gas to be used on the Island, demolished an old power station and built the new one on a brown field site which had to be cleared of pollutants, had the lead contractor go bankrupt half way through the project etc etc.

 

Astounding isnt it ? it all makes one wonder why the preferred site was Pulrose and why, when the main contractor went bust, the job wasnt farmed out to another contractor with suitable contractual arrangements in place.

We could also mention the extremely odd relationship between Enron MEA and the Enron owned contractor.

Talk about all your eggs in one basket. Hardly a model of risk management anyhow.

 

You say Proffitt hid things; no way; the MEA fully reported all his capital spends as required. Treasury didn't bat an eye as the reports came in and never reconciled all the information given to them. This was a terrible communications break down and both sides blame the other for letting it occur. In fact they are BOTH responsible.

 

Even the most charitable reading of events at MEA would question the motivation for utilising the special purpose vehicle to raise additional funds. You made mention of scale earlier in your post and I would have thought scale would have weighed heavily on the minds of everyone involved in what was obviously an act of desperation to keep MEA afloat. Its inconceivable that MEA didnt appreciate the magnitude of the amounts they were borrowing especially as it was intended to service only 40,000 customers. This amounts to more than a breakdown in communications IMHO.

 

The issue is whether they needed prior permision for MCC to take out loans.

No it isnt. There are two issues. First there has never been a satisfactory explanation as to why the special purpose vehicle was used to raise the money without getting the consent of Tynwald.

The second issue is a legal one regarding the status of the cash transfers between Manx Cable Company and MEA. It is this which KPMG have focussed on.

[finlo]

The Blackpool/IOM interconnector is the worlds largest immersion heater due to resistance etc!

Scottish power offered two cables from scotland to point of ayre @ 26 million and were told to stick it in their pipe and smoke it! Go think.

[LoneWolf]

The Blackpool/IOM interconnector is the worlds largest immersion heater due to resistance etc!

Scottish power offered two cables from scotland to point of ayre @ 26 million and were told to stick it in their pipe and smoke it! Go think.

 

2 cables each of 60 MW capacity. It all sounded too good to be true and it was.

Scottish Power didnt want the Power Stations so the Government would still have had to maintain enough generators to meet electricity demand .

There was also the question of the MEA pension liability if workers transferred to Scottish Power or were made redundant. It was enormous and would have to be met by the Government.

It didnt happen anyhow.

The problem we have now is a relatively short term cashflow problem for Government caused by the incredible infrastructure costs incurred by MEA. This will necessarily have an impact on other capital schemes which could be funded by Government.

Eventually the problem will disappear and we will be left with a very good energy infrastructure which, incidentally, the Scottish Power offer wouldnt have given us.

[finlo]

The Blackpool/IOM interconnector is the worlds largest immersion heater due to resistance etc!

Scottish power offered two cables from scotland to point of ayre @ 26 million and were told to stick it in their pipe and smoke it! Go think.

 

2 cables each of 60 MW capacity. It all sounded too good to be true and it was.

Scottish Power didnt want the Power Stations so the Government would still have had to maintain enough generators to meet electricity demand .

There was also the question of the MEA pension liability if workers transferred to Scottish Power or were made redundant. It was enormous and would have to be met by the Government.

It didnt happen anyhow.

The problem we have now is a relatively short term cashflow problem for Government caused by the incredible infrastructure costs incurred by MEA. This will necessarily have an impact on other capital schemes which could be funded by Government.

Eventually the problem will disappear and we will be left with a very good energy infrastructure which, incidentally, the Scottish Power offer wouldnt have given us.

 

Why wouldn't it ? much lower tariffs etc and very few MEA staff are involved in the generating of the stuff!

[Celt]

provided all the support infrastructure for domestic gas to be used on the Island,

 

If that's the case why do Manx Gas state that they invested £10 million in converting 22,000 people to Natural Gas? That works out at roughly £4500 per customer.

 

I think someones telling porkies.

[LoneWolf]

Why wouldn't it ? much lower tariffs etc and very few MEA staff are involved in the generating of the stuff!

 

I would have thought it was obvious that 2 cables would not have given us an energy infrastructure.

Government would still have to maintain on Island Generation with little or no possibility of a revenue stream to offset costs and we would not have natural gas on the Island. As for much lower tariffs you probably would be very surprised at how close some of the domestic tariffs are to those we pay. MEA tariffs are still cheaper after inflation than they were 5 years ago.

It didnt happen anyhow mainly because Scottish Power didnt want the Power Stations and because of the enormous pension liability.

All of which, of course, is not in any way on topic.

[LoneWolf]

provided all the support infrastructure for domestic gas to be used on the Island,

 

If that's the case why do Manx Gas state that they invested £10 million in converting 22,000 people to Natural Gas? That works out at roughly £4500 per customer.

 

I think someones telling porkies.

 

I dont think so. MEA built the support infrastructure which you could compare to the National Grid in England and Wales. They provided a high pressure pipe to get the stuff into Douglas and also provided a very expensive pressure reduction station to allow domestic gas to be tapped off. If Manx Gas wanted to take advantage of this infrastructure they would obviously have to convert their customers and link their distribution system to the infrastructure provided by MEA. This wouldnt be cost free and 10 million doesnt sound a hell of a lot for that sort of project.

No doubt they will recover the 10 million bucks over time. They no longer have to operate or maintain production plant. They dont need to maintain storage and should be able to sell off some of their redundant land assets for development purposes.

[finlo]

Why wouldn't it ? much lower tariffs etc and very few MEA staff are involved in the generating of the stuff!

 

I would have thought it was obvious that 2 cables would not have given us an energy infrastructure.

Government would still have to maintain on Island Generation with little or no possibility of a revenue stream to offset costs and we would not have natural gas on the Island. As for much lower tariffs you probably would be very surprised at how close some of the domestic tariffs are to those we pay. MEA tariffs are still cheaper after inflation than they were 5 years ago.

It didnt happen anyhow mainly because Scottish Power didnt want the Power Stations and because of the enormous pension liability.

All of which, of course, is not in any way on topic.

 

 

Just had a sniff around cheapest 6.25 pence dearest 8.65 pence economy7 2.42 pence. not much differance to our 11.5 pence i'll admit!

[LoneWolf]

Why wouldn't it ? much lower tariffs etc and very few MEA staff are involved in the generating of the stuff!

 

I would have thought it was obvious that 2 cables would not have given us an energy infrastructure.

Government would still have to maintain on Island Generation with little or no possibility of a revenue stream to offset costs and we would not have natural gas on the Island. As for much lower tariffs you probably would be very surprised at how close some of the domestic tariffs are to those we pay. MEA tariffs are still cheaper after inflation than they were 5 years ago.

It didnt happen anyhow mainly because Scottish Power didnt want the Power Stations and because of the enormous pension liability.

All of which, of course, is not in any way on topic.

 

 

Just had a sniff around cheapest 6.25 pence dearest 8.65 pence economy7 2.42 pence. not much differance to our 11.5 pence i'll admit!

 

You need to sniff around a bit further. Try Powergen in various areas and Yorkshire and N. Ireland.

Our prices are higher but not much more and they are still cheaper after inflation than 5 years ago.

Is there another product on the Island about which you can say that ?

You also need to wise up a bit about living where we do. We live at the end of a supply chain for most everything we consume. Check out the price of beer compared to Liverpool. Check out the price of white goods brown goods anything you like. You will find we are more expensive than most places in the UK.

[finlo]

Why wouldn't it ? much lower tariffs etc and very few MEA staff are involved in the generating of the stuff!

 

I would have thought it was obvious that 2 cables would not have given us an energy infrastructure.

Government would still have to maintain on Island Generation with little or no possibility of a revenue stream to offset costs and we would not have natural gas on the Island. As for much lower tariffs you probably would be very surprised at how close some of the domestic tariffs are to those we pay. MEA tariffs are still cheaper after inflation than they were 5 years ago.

It didnt happen anyhow mainly because Scottish Power didnt want the Power Stations and because of the enormous pension liability.

All of which, of course, is not in any way on topic.

 

 

Just had a sniff around cheapest 6.25 pence dearest 8.65 pence economy7 2.42 pence. not much differance to our 11.5 pence i'll admit!

 

You need to sniff around a bit further. Try Powergen in various areas and Yorkshire and N. Ireland.

Our prices are higher but not much more and they are still cheaper after inflation than 5 years ago.

Is there another product on the Island about which you can say that ?

You also need to wise up a bit about living where we do. We live at the end of a supply chain for most everything we consume. Check out the price of beer compared to Liverpool. Check out the price of white goods brown goods anything you like. You will find we are more expensive than most places in the UK.

 

I don't need to wise up just increasingly pissed off at getting ripped off at every angle off life over here plus quality of life here has gone down down down over last 20 years or so.

[LoneWolf]

I don't need to wise up just increasingly pissed off at getting ripped off at every angle off life over here plus quality of life here has gone down down down over last 20 years or so.

 

Quality of life is entirely down to yourself and the choices you make. If you are feeling a bit maudling do something that makes you feel good.

You arent really getting ripped off either. Take a bigger view of things. Sure, things are expensive but take account of the tax and rates situation, you are prob better off than you think compared to John Smith in Bradford. Best of all you live here not in Bradford.

Cheer up for God's sake !

[finlo]

Why wouldn't it ? much lower tariffs etc and very few MEA staff are involved in the generating of the stuff!

 

I would have thought it was obvious that 2 cables would not have given us an energy infrastructure.

Government would still have to maintain on Island Generation with little or no possibility of a revenue stream to offset costs and we would not have natural gas on the Island. As for much lower tariffs you probably would be very surprised at how close some of the domestic tariffs are to those we pay. MEA tariffs are still cheaper after inflation than they were 5 years ago.

It didnt happen anyhow mainly because Scottish Power didnt want the Power Stations and because of the enormous pension liability.

All of which, of course, is not in any way on topic.

 

 

Just had a sniff around cheapest 6.25 pence dearest 8.65 pence economy7 2.42 pence. not much differance to our 11.5 pence i'll admit!

 

You need to sniff around a bit further. Try Powergen in various areas and Yorkshire and N. Ireland.

Our prices are higher but not much more and they are still cheaper after inflation than 5 years ago.

Is there another product on the Island about which you can say that ?

You also need to wise up a bit about living where we do. We live at the end of a supply chain for most everything we consume. Check out the price of beer compared to Liverpool. Check out the price of white goods brown goods anything you like. You will find we are more expensive than most places in the UK.

 

I don't need to wise up just increasingly pissed off at getting ripped off at every angle off life over here plus quality of life here has gone down down down over last 20 years or so.

 

 

You also quote beer prices etc, belive me beer prices used to be far cheaper here than UK. It's so bad here now it's almost cheaper to get ripped off by the steam racket and spend your weekends across!

[LoneWolf]

You also quote beer prices etc, belive me beer prices used to be far cheaper here than UK. It's so bad here now it's almost cheaper to get ripped off by the steam racket and spend your weekends across!

 

Im with you on the beer prices but its just a part of living here. Other things make up for it.

 

That might be a good thread to start anyhow, beer prices in Mann. Why dont you /

[finlo]

You also quote beer prices etc, belive me beer prices used to be far cheaper here than UK. It's so bad here now it's almost cheaper to get ripped off by the steam racket and spend your weekends across!

 

Im with you on the beer prices but its just a part of living here. Other things make up for it.

 

That might be a good thread to start anyhow, beer prices in Mann. Why dont you /

 

My personal tax / car tax / rates etc have quadrupled in the past few years Joe blogs will pay for zero rate company tax and MEA cockups and pay dearly!